Hey gang! One of my friends who owns several coin shops in Ohio stopped by on Saturday and showed me this round. This round and many others fooled another Ohio coin dealer for the sum of around $25,000. He was showing it to me to show what's been circulating and I asked to photograph it and pass it on to you guys. A few things can save you from these... but I'm sure the counterfeiters have caught on by now. Firstly Englehard prospectors DON'T come with a "proof" finish. They should all be satin UNC. Secondly the coin weighs .98 Ozt. They all came in the plastic capsule shown. Don't mind the finger prints... Several dealers had looked at it in and out of the capsule before it got to me.
Not yet... but he is going to take it to another dealer who is going to hit it with the mass spectrometer and I'll find out then.
Matt unless it's your pictures the 999 looks to be a different type set also. From what I could see on the ebay pictures as mine are locked up at home I cannot access them to tell.
Interesting. These fakes look like a different variation than the fakes that were being warned about in December. The difference between the real and fake prospector then was the right hand. Real (1985 - I'm assuming they didn't change the design): http://www.ebay.com/itm/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&_trksid=p4340.l2557&hash=item3cbd670196&item=260875682198&nma=true&pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&rt=nc&si=ZtKhfEsWA6Bj%2B7CXVMWMRrnXkbM%3D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc Fake: http://www.ebay.com/itm/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&_trksid=p4340.l2557&hash=item20bfb8251f&item=140655469855&nma=true&pt=Coins_US_Individual&rt=nc&si=ZtKhfEsWA6Bj%2B7CXVMWMRrnXkbM%3D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc A different kind of fake: http://www.ebay.com/itm/ws/eBayISAP...fEsWA6Bj+7CXVMWMRrnXkbM=&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc On yours, the right hand is still different (no thumb holding the pan) and, if I'm counting properly, five fingers of the left hand are visible. No thumbs?
It says it is "5 PACK OF ENGELHARD COINS .999 FINE LAYERED SILVER " was that ever issued by Englehard? As for metallurgy of the fakes it is likely a tin copper alloy which if done right should mimic the weight and dimension of silver.
These kinds of things bother me because I would be one of the people that would fall for this. When I buy silver bars and rounds - i usually just make sure that their JM or Engel. I would have never considered that the 1oz engel round that I was buying could be a fake. There have been times when I've purchased silver rounds/bars from private individuals - trusted folks - but not a dealer. Now I'm going to have to think twice about that kind of thing.
I have been waiting for this. The chinese have faked a lot of coins, I was just wondering how long it would be that they faked silver rounds or other bullion. To me they could be easier to pass off to buyers since many buyers are not coin collectors, and don't pay that much attention to bullion, just count it. Just wait until they get the dies correct, and start cranking out correct weight issues. Thanks a lot for the warning Matt.
I am happy to report that my silver prospector rounds look nothing like these and are not fakes. Thanks for posting! TC
The Chinese have faking everything. Coins, apple products, antiques...and now metal detectors (for those who are in the hobby). I dunno about you, but if I had my way I would shut down every counterfeit operation in China and imprison everyone involved for a very long time. All counterfeiting does is hurt the hobby, and detract profits from fine and reputable American businesses. As heavy would say:
UGH, where can you buy small orders and feel safe? I only get 1 or 2 oz at a time and I know my LCS will not catch this type of thing. They do not have knowledgeable collectors, it's a coin/card/jewerly place. When I was brand new I unwittingly sold them a couple clad bars at full spot. they said 200mils right on them. I did not know but I can't believe they didn't. Maybe generics are actually safer b/c they are less likely to be copied?
Eagles are technically legal tender and subject to Secret Service investigations for counterfeiting claims. I believe this is why they generally carry higher premiums - less risk of counterfeits because counterfeiting carries more significant risk.
But so are coins and they are demonstrably being copied. I think the reason for premiums on ASE is two fold. One, they are coins and are collected by some, and two since you are familiar with the design its a little easier to have comfort in them.
