What's your guys thoughts on this coin? ebay Item number: 150202744584. It's slabbed by PCGS and i thought it looked good at first but now I'm starting to wonder. try this link: http://cgi.ebay.com/Attractive-Choi...ryZ11980QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
I am fairly certain this coin is from a hoard of similarly toned peace dollars, all first certified by NGC some years ago. I am also of the opinion the entire group may be AT, or at best are questionable. Regardless, they are attractive in-hand, and fooled me and the dealer I bought it from, and the advanced collector who sold it to him, so who knws for sure... FWIW, this is the first I've seen in PCGS plastic though, although others have reported seeing PCGS examples. Look at my last hone your grading skills post on peace dollars for another example (which I returned), as will a search for "1924 and toned" or "1922 and toned" on Heritage peace dollars, and draw your own conclusions.
The toning looks natural, but I'd bet a lot that the coin in hand doesn't look anything like that picture.
Really? I dont think it does. I mean, it kind of does, but intuition tells me that it could be artificial...
It's so hard to tell from the pictures. He does offer a return policy. At first glance of the obverse I thought it was no questions NT, but with the reverse toned like it is I don't know. Will a coin tone like this if it is in an albumn? My problem is that there are not many wild toned peace dollars on the market to compare with.
What I am saying is that with toning like that what you see when you look at it in hand is just a lot of dark brown toning. Yeah, if you turn the coin just so you can see splotches of color here and there. But for the most part it's just covered up with brown. As toning progresses it goes from being bright and colorful to darker colors, browns first and eventually black. And eventually the toning will turn into corrosion.
Having seen a very similarly toned coin presumably from the same "hoard" in-hand, and also having the opportunity to view several coins from this seller, it is safe to say that GDJMSP's opinion that the coin will not look the same in-hand is accurate as far as I'm concerned. However, I would stop short from it looking brown based on the example I've seen first-hand. Regardless, Pat's photos, in my opinion, are not an accurate representation of the coin in-hand and I would expect the colors in-hand will be less vibrant. That said, the seller, Pat Braddick, is a stand up guy by all accounts and you should have no problems whatsoever in buying from him. Just go into it with your eyes open. Respectfully submitted as my opinion only, and understanding the opinions of others may vary...Mike
You guys might be right. I looked at those 1924's on heritage's website and they looked dark almost black around the edges. This guys photos maybe enhanced.
It's just one day I'd like to own one nice NT colored peace dollar. Harder to find than a MS graded 1934 S peace dollar.
Good luck. I've been looking for several years now, only to be fooled by the last example. Finding an attractively toned example is not easy, and in my opinon Peace Dollars are by far the most difficult of the post-1900 types to find attractively toned....Mike
According to Bob Campbell (an expert on toning) Peace dollars do not tone naturally like other silver coins. It has something to do with the washing or rinsing process that was done differently on Peace dollars.
Yes, toning can turn into corrosion. How quickly depends on the surroundings. Regardless, it is not long after the toning on silver goes to "black". If you inspect coins with areas such as this this under extreme magnification, it is farily clear, but there's definite point where the blackness of toning starts to "eat" into the underlying luster/mirrors/surfaces, and it is at that point that (in my opinion) toning has turned into corrosion. That's not to say that all black toned silver is corroded, but beyond a certain point and to the extent it eats into the underlying luster it is. Please also note that that "point" is not often recognized by TPGs and they will allow a certain amount of luster/mirror/surface imparement in a toned coin, and some would even argue that all toning is corrosion (and in a sense they are right!) -- so there's hardly a concensus on the topic and the interpretation varies by the one doing the evaluation. To help illustrate the point I'm trying to make above, here is an example of a coin that is just about to hit that point, if not beyond it in points (note area around ES in STATES and the dark spot in the denticles and rim near U in UNITED): You will note some darker areas that seem to have the luster impared. This is where the toning is starting to eat into the luster, and it is at that point that it becomes corrosion. That said, I own this coin, and it is one of my very favorite coins, so this "problem" far from bothered me given the coin's grade and price. Although not mint state, here is a coin that has gone past that point and the toning has become corrosion. Some might call that crusty, or even a "Circ Cam". I call it corroded. All of the above is only my opinion based on my experience, and I respect those whose opinions may vary....Mike
The toning looks natural. I've run across many that look like this. They aren't rare, but just not nearly as common as similar toned Morgans. Usually the ones I find with similar toning are priced under $40. This coin does not look like the hoard coins. I've owned several of those coins and examined several dozen more and they look nothing like this. They are much more colorful with more defined toning patterns. I suspect these are naturally toned. If you want to take a shot at this coin, the seller Pat is a good guy and would honor his return privilege without hesitation.
a very nice explanation Leadfoot! but my question on this ... i agree that toning is a form of corrosion (to a point) and that it eventually will start to eat at the luster of the coin. With this in mind.. WHY would anyone pay alot of money beyond the numismatic value of a coin, just for its nicely toned surface? I dont get why a person would pay so much extra for a coin, where down the road, it will eventually lose that which they paid so much extra for....
http://www.cointalk.org/showthread.php?t=12578 Hobo - this was an interesting thread on the subject. Take a look at those different surfaces and I can believe that the surface has as much to do with it as any washing/rinsing had to do with it. I'm sure Bob probably knows a whole lot more than me but this was still an interesting group of pictures that might help explain differences in toning.?.
