Thoughts on collecting grade 70 slabs...

What opinions do you guys have about assembling a collection of SP and PR70's from PCGS? I notice that the silver issues trade well. Will they have some value down the road, or is it something that will only appeal to a small number of registry collectors? I'd like for my collection to have some value, even if I never end up selling any of it myself.

 

Log in or Sign up to hide this ad.

Depends if you're one of those people "Collect the coin and not the slab". I can tell you you'll pay big premiums for pretty much the same coins as 69's (not always, but most of the time). People have tried this before though.

 

That's what I'm afraid of, Hunt. I'd like to collect at least one though, to see if I can differentiate between a 69 and a 70.

 

Good luck on that. I have met several very experienced dealers who say they cannot tell the difference between a 69 and 70.

 

I guess it just depends on the coin. I've seen 70's that don't deserve a 68. I've seen 69's that i wonder why they did not get a 70. No two coins are alike. It's the same concept with people that want to put together a set of PR1 - MS70 of the same coin.

 

Regarding MS 70 coins. If you like them, if you want a registry set, if you can tell the difference and that tiny imperfection bothers you, please feel free to collect them. Seriously, I love when a collector buys a coin they love.

However, my objection has always been when people assume the 70's will always maintain their premium, or assert this premium "has" to go up in the future. Maybe it will, but to me the premium for a 70 versus a 69 is simply too large for me to ever wish to pay it.

Like most coin collecting, collect what you love because you love it. Never buy anything because of what someone else expects you to buy.

Chris

 

I guess my question isn't so much about collecting the coin, as it is about speculation. Will a silver PR70DCAM that costs 50-60 today be worth 100 a few years down the line? I just don't know what the trends are on these things.

 

69 to 70 is easier than 68 to 69, or 67 to 68. Usually 69 to 70 is a single mark.

I would like to see someone who will always agree with a TPG on 67-68 or 68-69 though.

For that matter, I would like to see someone who ALWAYS agrees with a TPG on anything.

 

Nothing wrong with collecting 70s. Some folks like having perfect coins. If I hear the cliche "buy the coin, not the slab" any more, I will scream. Collecting depends on the wants and needs of the collector, not anybody else. Some hobbyists want a beautiful coin in a " perfect" slab, so what exactly is wrong with that? The " buy the coin, not the slab" was stupid 20 years ago, and has not improved with age.

 

As long as PCGS doesn't have a shift in their definition of PR70 then I think there isn't any more downside to this endeavor than there is to essentially any other method of collecting coins. I believe in the past there have been times when a short burst has resulted in a large relative increase of PR70 coins for the JFK and Ike series. Additionally, in an area that I am much more familiar with, MS68 silver (1932-1964) WQs were almost never given out by PCGS from 1986-1999 or so and then within a year or two the populations exploded from around 10-pieces total to perhaps 40 or 50-pieces total. However, this did not hurt the PCGS MS68 market price for these coins.

I also think that folks can reliably tell the difference between PR69 and PR70 based upon a single experience of mine a few years ago. I had purchased a fairly large quantity of a modern gold coin from the US Mint and went through all the examples to pick out the 70 graded pieces for a PCGS submission. PCGS had been running something like 30-35% of the coins for the issue as graded 70, but the 30 or so coins I picked out resulted in about an 85% success rate for the 70 grade. So, picking out a 70 vs. a 69 can be done, at least in aggregate, by some folks.

 

That's a gamble you have to take, and it's not for everyone. If we could tell ya that PF70's would double in price over the next few years, dont ya think we would all be out buying PF70's .

That being said, if it makes you happy, go for it. It might pay off big, or it might not, it's not for everyone.

 

I would disagree sir. I can go to any major show and find probably 30 coins EASILY that are overgraded. Are you saying a collector should ignore the condition of the coin itself, or coins that they personally disagree with the assigned grade, SIMPLY because PCGS or NGC had a bad day?

No need to get into it here as we have had this conversation many places, and maybe the phrase is too often quoted, but I like it since it reminds everyone its the COIN that should determine value, not someone's OPINION on the coin. I used to tell new collectors to ignore the dealer's grade when judging whether to buy or not before slabbing, now I tell them the same thing if a coin is slabbed. Same thing, someone else's opinion should not matter to YOUR opinion. You are the one who will have it in your collection.

 

That is the biggest problem with buying modern PF70's. The feeding frenzy for Registry Sets bumps the prices way too high and then you must factor in the bidiots, but when it ends, the prices fall and never seem to go back up. In spite of some of their seeming screw-ups, the Mint has done a pretty good job of improving the proof-making process, so 70's are no longer scarce by any means.

I've said it numerous times before that if you can't tell the difference between a 69 & 70, then buy the 69 and save a bunch of money. Actually, it's not that hard looking at a raw proof and trying to determine if it would grade 70. If you can learn to do this, then submit them yourself and either add it to your collection or flip it while the feeding frenzy is still going hot and heavy. Then you have even more money to buy the 69's.

Chris

 

You know, in technicality....We shouldn't be using the phrase "Buy the coin not the slab", It should be "Buy the coin not the label". Because after all, the 70 vs 69 is printed on the label.

Just my thoughts :yes:

 

Well, I'm looking at one with a pop of 571, which doesn't really matter to me, but I suppose I've got to get one in hand in order to study and compare it.

 

That's a tough one.. Most of my slabs are actualy in the 66 range though I have several 67-69s as well. I have 1 PF70UCAM (2008 bald eagle commerative) and even that was a $20 premium over the pf69. As it was such a small difference I thought it worth the extra but I would not have paid out the PCGS value on the coin pcgs lists it as $35 for the 69 and $90 for the 70. So I look at it this way. If the price difference is not too extreme I would put up the cash for the 70 but otherwise I'm more then happy with a lower grade.

 

Sit on it, Hunt!

Chris

 

Sage advice. At this point, I'm looking at anything under 50. I'm not registry collector, and who knows how many more half dollars from this decade are going to get a 70, thereby diluting the value of them all?

 

I'd say I subscribe to this theory as well. I think a 69-grade is a nice meeting of quality and relative value, while holding up well to future re-sell-ability. If I look at my silver State Quarters collections, I am averaging buying at $11/coin for a 69-graded slab PCGS/NGC. PF70 versions are going for 4-5x that, and in general my eyes can't tell the difference without using a magnifier, meanwhile my wallet really can. If the 70's were selling for say 2x the 69, chances are I would go for them, but especially with moderns and even moreso proof moderns I don't think that much of a price difference for that little of a visual difference is worth it.

 

Nothing wrong with collecting 70s. Likewise, nothing wrong with collecting 69s, if you think them a better buy. Just don't use the slab as an excuse to buy a 70, if you really want the coin. I figure that the TPBs on average do far better than any member of the forum in determining the difference between a 69 and a 70, based on their experience. There are a lot of self-proclaimed experts around here, and every other coin venue.