Here's some nice colonials for your viewing pleasure. Three of these are quite rare. Can you ID them? And, what is different or unusual about these? (Members of CU forums please keep quiet). GTG if you want to, but that's really irrelevant as far as these are concerned.
There's a Carolina Elephant Token I can identify but other than that I'd be guessing so I'll stop. Really beautiful pieces though ...
That is a simply amazing grouping of Colonials. I would say the Washington with the Shield of New jersey is probably the scarcest from this grouping(?)
Eduard, I was hoping you'd stop by. Yep, the Washington NJ reverse is extremely rare with just 3 known. However, this is not one of the three. So, riddle me this: How can that be?
several of those are on my "buy list" when I win the lottery. I peruse the Colonial section of the US Red Book all the time drooling at them and watch Heritage Auctions as they pop up too. The General Washington one is interesting with the doubling.
Yes, that’s very rare, 3 known, as I noted previously. No one has a guess to the riddle? I’ll give you another hint: I own the piece, which is the same as the Garrett specimen, but it is not the Garrett specimen.
My instant reaction is that these are all copies. I'm not familiar with colonials (I'm guessing the vast majority of collectors are not familiar with colonials), but these pieces just feel... odd. That being said.... the elephant is one of the pieces that I stared at in the red book as a kid and always dreamed of owning.
If you absolutely forced me to commit: I'd say these were electrotype copies. These were popular in the early days of numismatics because they allowed collectors to see examples of otherwise rare coins. The somewhat "loose" appearance, coupled with the random.... "sparkiness"? (that's not the right description, but it's what my mind thought of....) They have an appearance that sorta looks like "casting bubbles" but they don't look like cast coins. Again, those aren't the right words. But the spots are due to the electrical currents depositing metal.
Winner, winner, chicken dinner. They are 19th century electrotypes. Pretty good ones, too. What gives them away is the stray lumps, especially around the letters. I call them “electro pops.” Some of them are quite rare on their own. The Roman Head Washington in the upper left would bring around 900, the George Clinton about 800, and the Washington NJ Reverse, which is the best known electro copy of the Garrett specimen, I’d guess at north of 2K. Think I’m crazy? An electro Birch cent and Eagle On Globe quarter both brought over 13K in the Heritage FUN auction.
No, I really don't think you are crazy. Electrotype copies, especially if they can be verified as to date or creator, can sell for pretty good prices. Many 19th century collections contained electrotypes of the rare coins - they were cheap, and filled holes in their sets for rare examples. It's understandable, if you think about it from their perspective. They weren't worried about the Chinese counterfeits that we have to contend with now, and they purchased these as clear and obvious copies. These have to be differentiated from modern electrotype copies. I am not familiar enough with the subject to be able to identify modern vs. contemporary?(ish?) electrotypes, but maybe you can point out a few key things to look for?
There are very few modern electrotype copies. I’ve only seen, perhaps, a dozen or so. Once you know what 19th century pieces look like, they’re rather obvious. It’s really tough to fake real age. The other thing that gives it away is if the electro is a copy of a famous piece. Those have been locked in known collections for many decades. Getting a copy of a rare piece was only one reason for the electrotype craze of 1840 to 1885. The other reason was for display pieces. Imagine you are Roper, Mickey, Parmelee, Cohen, Garrett. Do you really wanna take your rare whatever to show at coin club and have it “walk” or dropped? Of course not. So, many prominent collectors had electrotype copies made for “show and tell.” For those interested in the history, production methods, and tale of the 19th century electro’s, my article will be published in the upcoming PennyWise. I’ll also be posting some really neat pieces in the future. The really good pieces have fooled the TPG’s on a few occasions. I have some that are very dangerous and a friend pointed out a silver Immune Columbia that, as of the ANA convention, was still in a major TPG slab. There was only one tell-tale “pop” in the drapery. As soon as he showed it, my comment was, “Oooh, that’s not right.” He then showed me other close-ups with nicks and marks that were exact matches to another known genuine piece. That was probably a piece by the gang I call “The Fabulous Philadelphia Fabricators” (how’s that for some alliteration), which included Lyman Low, the Chapmans, J.N.T. Levick, W. Elliot Woodward and probably Idler and Haseltine. They got busted by the US Secret Service in 1885.
I thought they were electrotypes. There’s a couple super rare ones. The New Jersey Washington. The New York Indian is very rare too as is the Carolina elephant token. I had a beautiful electrotype wreath cent years ago. A au looking one. I sold it for I think $900. Was a looker anyway and itd sure get your attention until you examined the edge
This is just fascinating! I have a particular love for contemporary counterfeits. I’m going to have to study up on these electrotypes. Not that I’ll be able to afford one in any near future.
