Looks like AU to me. Great looking reverse except is that weakness in the E-PLURIBUS UNUM or just fading from the picture?
Nice coin. At least AU and maybe more. Just send it to me to be sure. Of course I wouldn't send it back you know.
question found in rolls... Why do you think that it was cleaned? It seems to me that you believe almost every coin posted here is cleaned. You may be very right but I don't see any apparent signs of cleaning. By the way I agree with GDJMSP that it is ef-45; seems like there is a little to much wear on it to make au. Pretty coin though.:smile
I think what foundinrolls is point at is that the coin is blast white....a coin just doesn't stay blast white--it tones...a dipping (sometimes called cleaning) will make the coin blast white again. It is said that 90% of Morgan dollars have been dipped at some point in time. I would say that he right.... Speedy
I was thinking the same thing. Maybe he is looking at the verticle lines instead of the horizontal bands neeed for FSB?
Here's a list. 1) Most notably , if you look at the coins obverse, you can see going from the upper left to the lower right, many fine lines. These are what we call hairlines that indicate that the coin was rubbed with a cloth. Unfortunately, most people use a cloth today that is mostly polyester fiber mixed with a little cotton. The polyester scratches the surface. This coin shows those scratches. Look near the L of LIBERTY, look around the motto, look between the B and E of LIBERTY, look at her cheek. etc. 2) The coin is too consistently white there is no trace of tarnish or toning on a coin that is 85 years old. That, contrary to popular belief is impossible on a circulated coin. 3) Look in the area of the LIB of LIBERTY. There is a slight change in the color of the surface of the coin. There are other spots but this is the most obvious. To the experienced eye, that is where there was tarnish before and the cleaning effects the surface differently in that spot. 4) Look to the left of the CA of AMERICA on the reverse. See the three small white dots. That's reside of the dip that was not rinsed properly, it changes the color of the surface. It usually shows up as cloudy white specks. 5) And...Yes, I think many of the coins posted here were cleaned at one time or another. I've examined literally millions of coins close hand and I have never missed spotting a coin that has ben cleaned. The signs are easily recognizable after awhile I hope this helps, Bill
Cleaning 1) The diagonal lines on the obverse imho are lines on the 2x2. 2x2 film is extemely refletive and with only a two dimiensional surface, it is hard to differenciate lines on the coin and lines on teh 2x2. Secondly lines wiped using a cloth/paper towel in my experience, are going in one or two directions, these are going in all directions at closer examination. The angle of light often reflects only one set of lines on the plastic. Also on the outside of the coin if you look closely fine lines of the same sort can be seen. And lastly, ususally lines going in the same direction can be seen on the obverse. None can be seen and the only reason the the plastic did not reflect is because the angle of the light was better. 2) There is probably no changing your mind on this one but I have seen hundreds upon hundreds of old circulated coins that have not tarnished at all. Coins are not made to tarnish, coins only tarnish when put under the right circumstances. (unfortunately these circumstances are very common) ps. sulfur causes toning on silver, Sulfur is not found everywhere. Sulfur only occurs in high enough concentrations as a result of smoking, etc. therefore not all silver coins have tarnish! 3) I know what you mean and I see what you mean on this coin. Without it in hand, I couldn't make a definative decision on whether or not these discolorations are effects of the light or as you said results of cleaning. 4) No question these spots are remains of humidity/moisture 5) can't argue with you there. But i don't think there is enough evidence to definitively say these coins are cleaned
Not true...when a coin is struck the metal is open to toning the sec it comes out of the die....a coin does tone and I don't know if I would say made to tone but it does tone normal. I would be willing to bet that the coins you have seen have been dipped at one point in time. Since back in the 1800's and such cleaning was said to be good we take that into the grade when we look at coins minted at this time. I think photos are hard to tell a grade with...and I would also say its hard to say 100% that a coin has been cleaned from photos.....but I do disagree with the quote above and wanted to post why. Speedy
Hi, Speedy is right. There is nothing done at the mint to stop toning from occurring. A coin will tone unless treated in some way not to do so. The coin would need to be in a vacuum in order not to begin to tone. A coin has to be in contact with something if it is not hermetically sealed the moment it comes off the press. Even slabbed coins tone. In fact there is a company producing a chemical that is used to retard toning on slabbed coins. If you've seen old coins , silver or otherwise without some form of toning, it has been cleaned. That is pure and simple. All coins change color as a result of being in contact with air, humidity etc. It is possible for a coin, let's say to have toning so light as to be almost non existent but there is still some effect on the surface of any older coin. My thoughts on this dime haven't changed. It was cleaned. Thanks, Bill
2) There is probably no changing your mind on this one but I have seen hundreds upon hundreds of old circulated coins that have not tarnished at all. Coins are not made to tarnish, coins only tarnish when put under the right circumstances. (unfortunately these circumstances are very common) ps. sulfur causes toning on silver, Sulfur is not found everywhere. Sulfur only occurs in high enough concentrations as a result of smoking, etc. therefore not all silver coins have tarnish! Only partially true. Yes Sulfur is one of the most common tarnishing effects on Silver which becomes Ag2S ( excuse the lack of lower case numbers). However, there is also 3Ag2O, AgNO3, etc. Sulfur is actually very, very common in our air and is one of the most destructive air born compounds we have in the air. It is present everywhere due to the burning of Sulfur rich coal in power stations, factories, founderies, etc. The after effects of this is SO or SO2 pushed into the air and when in contact with moisture, H OH otherwise known as H2O, it becomes an air born acid (H2SO3 or H2SO4) which attacks everything. That is why all Silver coins, silver dinnerware, etc. everywhere there is air becomes toned otherwise none as tarnish. The tarnish that is formed is Ag2S and if removed in any form from a coin will take the Ag (Silver) with it. There are other lesser known air born contaminates such as the NO3 radical in moisture forming an acid which also creats a Silver Nitrate but much, much less prevelant except in loosely controlled chemical factory areas of the country. Even just plain old air can attact Silver forming 3Ag2O but also takes a long, long time. Regardless of the type of contaminate that effects all Silver coins, the removing (cleaning) dose in fact remove some of the Silver. It has to. Cleaning that removes a Silver Sulfite, Sulfate, Nitrate or Oxide must take the Silver with it. ] Summation is to NOT clean coins.
