Boring chilly day here on the plains and as I was going thru some of my foregin stuff I found this baby. A 1970 2 Groschen from Austria. The only deal is all 260,000 of them are PROOF according to the Krause. It'll only fetch a buck or two as it's seem some circulation, but it's neat. Bone
In the last few months, I've pulled two proofs out of rolls of halves - a 2002S and a 1976S. I've also pulled out 2002 D&P,and a 2003D.
I have no clue, I've heard the strike is much more defined. The only way I kneww this was a proof was the fact they minted no regular coins. All 1970's were proof... Bone
I have found 12 Kennedy Proof halfs from circulation (rolls). That's out of about $20,000 in half rolls.
Does anyone have the patience to explain grading for me? I understand the basic of it... So, mainly, grading is based on a coin's luster and wear, right? Scratches also play into it, right? But how many scratches would it take to bring the grade down?
Buy the Book Before You Buy the Coin We could have an entire Forum on grading. If you want to know, there are books out there that you should own, such as the ANA Gradiing Guide, the PCGS Grading Guide, and so on. The basics are the same -- as you know. The devil is always in the details. Even The Red Book has at least quick guidelines for grading. As for "how many scratches lower the grade" that is the Big Question. If you are an ANA member, you can borrow for free (postage and insurance both ways; no charge for the rental per se) the ANA videos on Gradiing. Their grader and authenticator, J. P. Martin (now with ICG) explains over and over why that mark on that coin is detracting but this mark on this coin is not. It takes work and practice. For an online resource, try this book by Jim Halperin of Heritage: http://www.coingrading.com/intro1.html I still recommend a real book. You need something you can use at a desk with your coins, something you can highlight, underline, make notes in, put stickies in, etc. The ANA Grading Guide is perfect for that.
Not Just Shinier As noted, Proof coins tend to have frosty images and lettering on a mirror background. That is mostly true for modern coins. after about 1970. For earlier coins, you often have to KNOW the coin intimately to know the difference between a true proof and a superior business strike. The first business strikes off the press will often have proof-like characteristics. The dies are fresh and sharp. However, true proofs are struck on polished (or at least cleaned) planchets. As a general rule, Proofs are struck multiple times, not just once. In fact, Breen defines proof this way -- and that makes all 1907 Double Eagles to be proofs -- and not everyone agrees on that, certainly not the people who paid more for "real" proofs.-) Also, very often, proofs are struck from different dies. That is why you have to know the coin. Generally speaking, Mints do not use the same dies for proofs as for circulation strikes. However, this does happen -- both in the USA during lean years in the 1800s and in small nations, of course -- so you have know when that took place and when it did not.
I've found that for grading circulated coins, Photograde is a big help. I don't have the skill to grade uncirculated coins so I generally just rely on an expert opinion in the form of a slabbed coin from a reputable grading company. They aren't perfect but they are better than I am.
Reply: Your post on scratches. Yes they come into play, but its really about the amount of scratches, how deep they are and how apparent those scratches are on the high points of the coins. Really its about judgement and its up to you how much you think the coin should be down-graded. Its all opinionated.
They should have some trace of a mirror finish, unless they've been well circulated. Even if the finish is gone or almost gone, you'll still be able to tell by the much sharper strike it has. Also checking dates and mintmarks... some year and mintmark combinations were only ever made as proof. I have a 1989-S Kennedy half I got in ciruclation that lost the mirror finish, but can be identified as a proof because of the sharpness of the features, and the fact that San Francisco only ever minted Kennedy halves as proofs (only exception being bicentennials they minted for unciruclated sets).
I used to occasionally get some coins that had been taken out of Unc. sets & spent.These coins were officially only struck for the sets.Examples include the 1989 50c. & 1992 20c. coins from New Zealand.I have even had a Proof 1990 $1 coin from New Zealand turn up in change,plus a 1993 $2 coin,which depicts a kingfisher instead of the Kotuku (white heron). Aidan.
The finish to me look,s more mat then proof, A proof coin has much more of a mirror like Finish, maybe it,s just the photo?
