Need some advice about an EBay Transaction gone horribly wrong

I posted a winning bid on a "1921-D ANACS Graded AU50 VAM-1L" coin on eBay ($29.99+shipping). What I got in the mail was a "1921-D VAM-1L DETAILS CLEANED AU50". I was furious. Contacted the seller, was told in essence "too bad, so sad". In successive e-mails he told me I was "stupid", "an *******" and a "nut job" never once acknowledging he's done anything wrong. So I opened a case with eBay, who immediately refunded my money. I'm still trying to decide whether to contact the Georgia Governor's Office of Consumer Protetction about this guy.

I'm really of two minds. On the one hand he clearly left out important information about the coin. The "DETAILS CLEANED" information is smack in the middle of the full grade, so he didn't accidentally leave it out. On the other hand he has a good feedback score on Ebay, with no mention of any issues like this before. Of course he's sold very few coins, he seems to be mostly a junk dealer. I am obvoiusly irate over my treatment and want to land on him with both feet and an anvil, so a rational decision is not possible at this junction.

Here's the initial e-mail exchange. It only gets worse from there.

Dear [Redacted],

Boy, am I ****ed off at you. You didn't put a picture up of the coin so I had to take what you said in the decription as fact. What you said in the description was correct, but missing the all important "DETAILS CLEANED". You saw fit to skip right over that and note the Variety.

If I had known that I would NEVER have bid on that coin. If you're going to quote an ANACS grade, you have to quote the COMPLETE grade. Failing to disclose a salient fact is dishonest and illegal.

You need to resolve this, and you need to resolve it in my favor, before I report you to eBay, The Georgia State Prosecutor's Office and the Postal Service's Mail Fraud unit.

"In my favor" means that you take the coin back and refund shipping BOTH ways along with a letter of apology. If I lose a single penny on this puchase I will be extraordinarily displeased and in the least hesitant to let everyone I can think of know it.

Sincerely,

[Redacted]

and the response:

Dear [Redacted]

I cant help stupid.. If you had any question you should have asked.. What Grade did you think you were getting???. I usually have no problem refunding both product + shipping but in your case you I will stick to stated policy.. Return the coin for refund YOU PAY SHIPPING
[Redacted]

So what would you do if something like this happened to you?

 

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I'm sorry but think you are over reacting to this it is only a thirty dollar coin. Paying return shipping is normally part of the listing and is kind of standard in coin listings.

BTW I have been on both ends of coins not meeting expectations and have refunded without comment, and also not cared for a coin and paid return shipping with Delivery Confirmation to get my refund.

 

In the future I'd suggest you not bid on coins without clear pictures of the item.
Guy

 

You bought a coin on Ebay that had only a written description and no picture in the listing? Then you exacerbated the problem with immediate obscenities to the seller? Worst of all, You told us about your mistakes?
You've embarrassed yourself enough. Keep the coin as a lesson learned.

 

I'd return the coin... Neg the guy... Not so much for the coin... But how he handled the issue... And move on.

 

Notice that in the first contact to the seller, The OP started with unsavory language and a nasty attitude. OP could have started out on a more positive not but chose to be aggressive and accusatory right from the start. The seller may have made a mistake. Problem may have been easily solved. The seller might have done a better job with this communication, but I stand by my advice to the OP. Suck it up and leave no feedback at all.

 

Well, right off I can see where some mistakes were made that would result in nothing but a back and forth argument to ensue.

1. You used the word "you" way too much. It is best to avoid using "you" in an argument as it puts the other person in a defensive mode. I learned this from an academic skills course I was required to take back in high school. Sadly, this course is no longer required for graduation.

2. Tossing around threats in your first contact and demanding a written letter of apology was way over the top. It makes you look irrational and hotheaded. The best thing to have done was to explain to the seller why you are displeased with the coin and that you want to return it for a refund because it was not fully described.

This seller may not know much of anything about coins nor how important it is for a collector to know if a coin has been designated as cleaned or not. Were there not pictures of the coin and its holder in the listing? If I were the seller I would have likely responded in a more tactful yet similar way as well.

 

"Worst of all, you told us about your mistakes?"

Rick, I'd question that an analogy for 'ticked' is an obscenity. Beyond that, it was the original intent of my post, am I over-reacting? I am not in slightest embarrassed. I offer my experience truthfully so that I and others can learn from it. Its interesting to hear you inveigh against "attack tactics" when It's a favored method of your own, that original post on this topic most definitely included. I *had* some measure of respect for you. Sorry, it's gone.

 

What did you expect from after you started your email off with, "boy, I'm really ****ed off at you."?

Don't waste THEIR time with this nonsense. If there was no photos of the coin on the listing, you should have:

1.) Reported the listing to eBay for listing violations.

2.) Not bid, since there was no photos on the listing.

3.) Contacted the seller asking for pics.

Questionable at best.

Again, you could have passed on bidding, or even contacted the seller and asked for photos.

Again, your arm was not twisted, forcing you bid.

Holy cow!

You weren't expecting an invitation for tea and crumpets, were you?

Ever hear the saying, "You can catch more flies with honey, than vinegar." ???

Seriously?

 

I am very careful to read all the postings for the "RATINGS" on the previous buyers reviews. This often gives you a good clue as to what the seller is really like. Of course you can't take every negative post as reason to stay away, but I heavily consider where the person leaving the negative states the seller was abusive and uses derogatory language as an indicator there could be problems and then I do avoid them.

I buy a lot of coins on eBay, some are less than "As Advertised" In coins it is expected that YOU MUST disclose coins being cleaned. However, the use of Acetone that is swiftly and completely rinsed with distilled water rarely leaves a sign and is not really an issue in my humble opinion.

 

BU, points well taken I almost certainly should have taken some time to cool down before contacting the seller, and my approach should have been softer. I let emotion cloud my judgement. And I right, however, in assuming that the seller was in the wrong because of his failure to disclose a crucual fact? At some point he should acknowledge that even if it was an error, it was a critical error. My impression was that he was angry because I had caught him out.

Also, I think you can excuse my bidding despite there being no picture as the coin was advertised as ANACS graded. Thanks for your input.

 

Sounds like two fish swimming upstream to me.

 

I would contact the Atorney General. He cant be allowed to get away with this

 

You're in the right to complain; omitting "details, cleaned" is clearly deceptive, whether it was intentional or not.

As others have pointed out, though, you shot yourself in the foot with your initial email.

I'm not sure what I'd recommend about feedback. I'd hate to see the guy do this to others, but it's possible that it was an honest mistake he won't repeat. I'd be inclined toward leaving a neutral, but I think a neg would be justified as well. (Were I in his shoes, though, I'd definitely leave a response to the neg pointing out that you were aggressive and hostile from the outset.)

You might both be better off just letting go of this.

 

+1

 

What purpose would a letter of apology serve? I think that's the point where (if I were the seller) I would have thought you were a real looney-bin.

Just ask for a refund, and send the coin back.

Or, realize it was $30 and a lesson learned. As others have alluded to, why would you ever bid on a coin without pictures, regardless of what the listing said it was?

 

That initial email sure was a mistake, lol. I think if you had approached him calmly, and said you were displeased and weren't expecting a cleaned coin, this may have gotten straightened out quickly.

 

Here's how your first email should have said (keep in mind, keep it short and simple):

Dear Seller,

The coin you listed did not state that it was CLEANED. I would like to return this coin as it was not described properly in the auction listing.

Thanks,

Buyer

He likely would have responded saying you can return it. If the seller got nasty after you sent a polite email of the problem, you simply just tell him you'll take it up with EBay's Protection Plan that is covered on all auctions and you'll leave negative feedback for the poor description (or lack of), etc.

I have no sympathy for you though, you started the whole controversy and could have avoided this mess since even in his initial response (not counting the negative comments fired back but can you blame them) they stated: "

I usually have no problem refunding both product + shipping but in your case you I will stick to stated policy.. Return the coin for refund YOU PAY SHIPPING"
​

 

Well, do you think the seller was really out of line after he was attacked first in the initial email the buyer fired his way? His emotions got the best of him and he got defensive. So who's to really blame from what's been provided? I say the buyer is more to blame. Sure the seller didn't put CLEANED in his description, shame on him but I say you can't leave a negative on how he handled the situation, he still stated he would provide a refund if the item is sent back. I'd say if any negative is left, leave it on the poor description but even that could have been avoided if the buyer didn't fire off with an email that starts with "Boy, am I ****ed off at you." Geez! I'd say leave no feedback, get your $30 bucks back and be done with it and learn to be polite, you might just be surprised with the return results.

 

Which the OP should pay return shipping, just as a lesson how NOT handle something like this in the future :thumb: