Large Cent Tip #2

This appears to be a low grade unattributed S-182 with the bald spot above the 1 and reverse EE. Oddly enough, it's the one EE obverse I didn't have in my collection. Wear makes the alternative attribution points difficult to use, but it looks right to me.

This is R4 Estimates 118-158 survivors.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Scarce-1798-Dra...86?pt=Coins_US_Individual&hash=item4aabcd3756

 

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Hi Marshall,
Where are the "tips" in these posts? You're attributing some worn and beat up ebay large cents. But I'm not catching the tips.

I love large cents. I just picked up an 1839/6 and upgraded an 1844/81 at the Heritage auction.
Lance.

 

The tip is the auction itself. Some people collect by variety and this helps them locate some of the tougher varieties.

 

Oh, I get it. Say, that's a pretty nice service, Marshall.
Lance.

 

Marshall is the man! He is a tremendous help.

 

I enjoy attributing those worn Large Cents and would honestly like to stir up interest in this series again. It was the first series that I know of which was collected by date when it was discovered that the 1799 was hard to find and the first to be collected by variety by early numismatists (at least that I know of). Much of what we know about the minting precess was centered around this series. But I warn you, if you like finishing the sets, this one isn't for you. It can't be done though Holmes almost did it. There was that one variety which is unique and in the ANA collection which stopped him.

If I can stir interest by pointing out affordable rarities and near rarities, then I'm happy as a lark.

 

100%

if marshall has something to say about something on ebay its definately worth a look.

 

Believe it or not there is another collector who is close. He has 342 of the 355 varieties. There are several unique varieties and Holmes had all but the 1793 NC-5 which is in the ANS collection, not the ANA collection. As far as I know none of the other unique varieties are permanently impounded in museum collections so duplicating the Holmes accomplishment is still possible in theory.

 

Here are some I haven't been able to attribute. I don't have the references for cents prior to 1816. I need to do something about that.

I think the 1798 is the small 8, type 2 hair.
Lance.

 

I'll reply one at a time.

The 1798 is a S-175 and really pretty. This is a link to the Holmes example with the same reverse CUD:

http://www.icollector.com/1798-S-175-R4-Style-II-Hair-with-Small-8-VF30_i8599345

 

The 1800 took a bit. It is a S-209 and either a Die State I or II. The stray vertical hair between the top two curls below the ribbon and Right leaning E confirm the variety. It took me a while to rule out an early die state of the NC-4 which shares the reverse.

This is the Holmes link: http://www.icollector.com/1800-S-209-R3-PCGS-graded-MS65-Red-Brown_i8599418

 

The 1803 is an S--250 with a fading shoulder line with the POC under the curve of B. The Reverse H had a distinctly low fraction bar and a stemless berry under E(D).

This is the Holmes example: http://www.icollector.com/1803-S-250-R2-VF35_i8599514

 

The 1808 is S-279 most easily identified by the leaf tip under the center of the S on the Reverse C.

This is the Holmes example: http://www.icollector.com/1808-S-279-R1-AU50_i8599573

 

That's what I get for using my memory instead of the search button. As usual, I defer to your greater knowledge. Are you sworn to secrecy about this new collection? I'm fascinated with the possibility of someone repeating the Holmes feat. I would have thought that would never happen again.

 

The 1813 is the S-293 with the obverse giving me a little problem. The top star seems to be pointing a bit higher than either Obverse A or B, the two known Obverses of 1813. The reverse is definitely Reverse B so I call this the S-293. I suggest you have someone take a look at the obverse though to verify the top star is actually correct and just looks high in the photo.

This is the Holmes S-293: http://www.icollector.com/1813-S-293-R2-EF40_i8599590

I would also check out what appears to be a die break from the right bottom of the second 1 to the rim. It is not mentioned by Breen but it looks like a break in the photo and not a scratch. You need to see it in hand to verify that. If it is, then you may have a new later die state.

 

Pretty cool Marshall! I've always loved large cents, but never got in to collecting them. I've always been a more "from circulation" collector. Maybe someday I'll find one in a box of half dollars Anyway I appreciate the tip on this one. I'd like to buy a few large cents, but have always been afraid of counterfeit coins. Any suggestions on how to avoid those?

 

I am certainly not an expert on counterfeit detection, but counterfeiters usually get variety issues wrong. They may use a reverse of a middle date or at least the wrong year, use wrong punches, etc. They do continue improving their skills, so if they do get it right, I might not know it.

 

Very cool, Marshall. Thank you for the help! I've made a note of each for my inventory.

I took another look at the 1813. I think that's not a die break at the bottom of the second 1 in 1813. It appears to be light catching flow lines, as the numbers are drawn toward the rim the way the stars often are, with worn dies. There's a bit of it with the first 1 as well. Do you agree? Here are some new photos.

When you speak of the top star are you referring to star 7 or 8? Here's another obverse, if that helps. These photos are also larger. Don't know if that makes much difference.

I have a handful more...different dates...but you've already given me too much help. Another time, maybe.

Thanks again.
Lance.

 

hes talking about the 8th but i dont see anything that would tell me its not a S-293.

 

Actually, I was talking about the 7th star, but I now think it was just an illusion of height from wear on the headband. The "die Break" may very well be an extreme example of flow lines on a very worn late die state coin.