I am giving some thought to joining NGC. I am thinking about upgrading to the Premium Membership level. They charge $109.00 annually for this, but you get a coupon for five free submissions. I think this is kind of pricy, but am curious what the rest of you think. PCGS also has a similar deal. I am into collecting Philadelphia Mint Morgan Silver Dollars, and have started to upgrade my collection to better quality coins. I have been purchasing slabbed coins that are MS-64 or MS-65. I have a couple of raw coins that I am curious as to what they would grade. I have my opinion, but am curious as to what the experts would thing and/or rate. I would love to hear your feedback. Thank you.
Seems like PCGS is the preferred TPG on this forum, but I'm personally an NGC guy. In general people say they overgrade coins a bit more than PCGS but I'm not sure I believe that; others can offer better information on that than I. Keep in mind that those "free" submissions require shipping/insuring fees that are usually close to $50.00, so it's not quite as free as you might think.
I joined at the associate level last year. The premium membership is actually a very good investment, considering the free submissions benefits . I rarely if ever purchase " Raw " coins , so for me that was not an issue to consider, nor do I play the " crossover " game.
I would go with PCGS, they're both top tier grading companies, but PCGS is clearly becoming the leader in the marketplace. I don't know any dealers who crack out PCGS coins to send to NGC, but I know a LOT of dealers who do the opposite.
Search in "whats it worth" forum for a thread title My First NGC submission. I am going to soon do a PCGS submission also.
Join one, join both, join none. The PCGS will only allow you to add PCGS coins to your registry on the PCGS site. The NGC will allow you to add NGC, PCGS, other company, raw, coins to your set registry on the NGC site. I use the set registries of both sites to help with the "checklist" aspect and price guide. Other than that, I am a Life ANA member and am working on my first GSA coin submission to NGC. One more coin and I'll meet the minimum.
The people who claim that NGC overgrades drink too much Kool-Aid; the people who claim that NGC undergrades drink too much Kool-Aid, too! Chris
Clearly becoming the leader in the marketplace? So you say! Perhaps dealers crack out NGC coins because PCGS is more lenient in some cases. For example, NGC has tougher standards for FBL Franklins. Personally, I've had Morgans bodybagged (old grading system) by NGC that got slabbed by PCGS. You also have to remember that the PCGS Registry will not accept coins certified by NGC, but NGC will accept coins certified by PCGS. So, it is only natural that members of the NGC Registry don't have to bother with cracking out or crossing a coin graded by PCGS. Chris
I sort of avoid the situation in two ways: 1. I'm an ANA member so I can submit to NGC without having to join. Still have to pay the submission fees and don't get some of the benefits, but that's okay with me. 2. I buy coins already slabbed. That avoids even having to consider joining.
FBL franklins seem to be one of the exceptions, as PCGS only considers the lower set of Bell Lines and NGC considers upper and lower sets. I certainly do not think that PCGS is looser than NGC, however, of late, NGC seems to be trying too hard to tighten up, IMO in response to negative perception of their standards. Remember that market acceptability is pretty darn important and right now, PCGS has better market acceptance then NGC. At least from where I sit it does... PCGS coins bring more money at Heritage, at least the ones I track certainly do.
So, are you implying that the tightening of standards at PCGS, i.e., toners, is not due to a negative perception of their standards, but the company was just being kind to the collectors on earlier submissions? It sounds like you are using a double standard to me. Chris
But the same is true with all special designations. In each case NGC has tougher standards than PCGS does. Hmmm - if you use the 2010 Proof ASE coin as an example, which out of the 44,000+ plus total graded by PCGS, that 36,000+ of that 44,000 were graded as PF70 DCAM by PCGS - it seems that PCGS has pretty dang loose standards on that basis ! Ahhhh but there are also plenty of examples where the NGC graded coins bring more money than those slabbed by PCGS. Of course this doesn't really prove anything because any knowledgeable collector knows that no 2 coins are the same even if they are the same grade. And even if they are graded by the same company you will see 1 bringing more or less money than the other. To be honest, in my opinion both companies have loosened their standards to the point that it has become a joke !
....while we're on the subject I have been eying a couple of 2009 Lincoln dollar commem sets (PR70 and MS70 coins in each set) on Ebay. An NGC set is selling for $249 and a PGCS set is selling for $399. Some PGCS sets are in the md $00 range as well. Should there be that much of a price difference? can I assume both sets are of equal quality? Sorry for the hijack but I guess the answer might also influence which organization i might join. Thanks
Neither of the sets should be that high! It's not uncommon for prices to go unreasonably high when Registry collectors are competing for them, but when the smoke settles, the prices will drop and you will be able to get them for less. If you buy them when the prices are high, you will likely never recover your cost. Even more important, is the fact that if you can't tell the difference between a 70 and a 69, you are better off buying the 69 for much less money. Chris
The tightening of the standards related to the market acceptability of toned coins changed drastically at PCGS the day they decided to encapsulate problem coins as "GENUINE" instead of body bagging the coins. In order to protect their advertised claim that they don't grade AT coins, the scale of market acceptable toning became much smaller.
For me, I like PCGS for First Spouse Gold and NGC for First Spouse Tokens. The former because, for this series, the prices are consistently higher and the latter because my PCGS medals are often disappointing, spots and scratches on the portrait of an MS 68? not on any of my NGCs. I also like NGC because of the look of the multi-slab.
Do what I do, watch the coins that I watch on Heritage.... I was paying attention to Barbers, SLQs and Walkers at the FUN sale. With the noted exceptions, on the coins I was watching, whenever there was a PCGS coin and an NGC coin, the PCGS coin almost always sold for more money, sometimes a tremendous premium. 05-O Barber Halves 13-S Barber Quarters 16-P Walkers 18-P Walkers It flipped in a big way to NGC's side on the 27-S Walkers, but the NGC coin had a MUCH better strike 34-Ds were even 35-S, the NGC 66+ was under the PCGS 66. 17-P T1 SLQs Of course you buy the coin and not the plastic, but the problem here is market acceptability, and what's happening is that a lot of the good coins are getting crossed to PCGS. If you saw the results for the 05-O Barber Halves and YOU owned one in NGC plastic that you were considering selling, what would YOU do?
Nothing, for 2 reasons. One reason I would do nothing is because I know that the only time it makes a difference is when a plastic buyer is bidding. The other reason is because I know that no two coins are equal.
rld14 I fully agree, in nearly every instance of the 1913 S B/Q. The funny part is that NGC grades Barbers far more strictly than PCGS, yet PCGS gets the better $'s.
Go figure! I think you can argue either way and everybody has there own prefrence but for resale PCGS seems to have the edge be it for Paper or Coin for me though it,s always been PCGS
