The portrait on this coin reminds me of the ones I have seen of Gordian III as Caesar. It was labelled as being from Antioch, AD 243-244 when I purchased it. Can anyone verify that? or give me any more information on this coin? --------------------------------------------- Gordian III Antoninianus "Victory" Gordian III AD 238-244 Antoninianus Obv: IMP CAES M ANT GORDIANVS AVG - Radiate bust right, draped and cuirassed. Rev: VICTORIA AVG - Victory advancing left, holding wreath and palm. weight: 5.49 Grams ---------------------------------------------
Very nice addition, I like how you can see some of the detail's in victory's wings as well as the details around the legs.
Thank you. I think Victory looks quite nice on this one, you can see all her facial features. Also I do agree, the wing detail looks nice, a beautiful representation of Victory. It seems Gordian III's face looks a bit different than in many other portraits seen of him on coins. I find it quite beautiful. It is an interesting and less common type, and I am hoping someone can give me some more information about it. I also meant to add that the weight of the coin is 5.49 grams, so good weight for the type. I am just hoping to find out if someone can give me a reference number or something....or even just tell me whether or not this is from Antioch?? Anyone?
I don't specialize in Gordian and have not studied any recent material on the subject but this coin sure looks like Rome for the first issue (early in the reign) with the portrait that looks a bit like Balbinus (another suggestion of being easly) cataloged as RIC #5 (July 238-July 239). RIC does list #202 as Antioch of local style with the same types separated by style. For more help, you'll need someone much more expert in the series. I'll point out that easy to find Internet listings on the 5 vs. 202 question will not all be conclusive.
Hm, I thought the portrait did look slightly like those of Balbinus. The coin was sold as being from the Antioch mint, AD 243 - 244 = RIC IViii, 214 RARE, page 37 - Cohen 179 The only one I found of RIC #5 that looks similar in style is this one: http://www.wildwinds.com/coins/ric/gordian_III/RIC_0005.1.jpg Thanks for the info doug.
Well I looked for a while at examples of both RIC 5 (Rome Mint) and RIC 202 (Antioch Mint) To me the face looks more like the ones I am seeing more often on the Antioch examples, but the lettering looks similar on both Antioch and Rome examples in some cases.... so no definitive answer, I'm sure an expert of Antioch mint styles might be able to tell, but not I.... some of the Antioch examples I looked at looked clearly Eastern, others that were from Antioch, looked like alot of Rome mint examples....
My suggestion is that you not take as absolute the ID's of the coins found claiming to be Antioch. As you say, some are clearly Eastern but some could be the result of a cataloger who knows no more about it than you do. For more guidance on this, I might suggest posting on Forvm and hoping for a clue fom Curtis Clay or someone else who is really into these distinctions. There always seem to be coins that just don't fit the easy distinctions we rely on and that may just mean that our previous ideas were more easy than correct. RIC separates Antioch into local style and a style copying Rome. How this idea has held up to 50 years of further investigation is unknown to me.
Probably because there hasn't been 50 years of investigation! The eastern mints from Septimius Severus to Gordian III are still woefully underpublished. Those who know what to look for can identify them properly in an instant, but its surprisingly difficult to learn. I would NOT trust any of the info on wildwinds for this stuff. Heck, I barely even trust the CNG database/coinarchives when working on eastern mint issues.
Well I guess this might be trickier than I thought to ID, heh. But I did buy the coin for the wonderful young Gordian III portrait as well as the great detail on Victoria on the reverse, and not because of what mint the seller listed it being from, or the possibility of it being rare or valuable. Also at 5.49grams, it's fairly heavy for the Antoninianii of Gordian, not that coins of this weight of him are very rare or anything. I figured if it was the Eastern issue, that would just be a bonus to the wonderful coin I truly liked when I first saw. And I paid less than what a decent grade of the most common of Gordian Antoninianii would cost, even with today's lower prices. I appreciate everyone's help, especially you doug and you too Ardatirion, thank you both. I will still post some better photos if I can manage to get any.... these are pretty good, I'll try though.
There is a major difference between no investigation and no publication. Much of the new work on these things is being done privately by people who have to fund the study by themselves. The traditional sources of serious studies are slowing up when it comes to putting out books. I suspect there may be as much online as you will find in traditional publishing formats. Certainly it is more up to date. Unfortunately I have known studies that stopped due to the death of the private student. There are several decent collections of Gordian III online and confusion as to the organization of the Eastern coins is a common theme. We are in good company. I have been hoping for several years that a replacement RIC IV would come out and help all this. I have serious doubts that I will live to see it.
Very true. But I wouldn't say the traditional sources of studies are slowing up, rather they're focusing on different things. General catalogs are not in vogue right now - this is why we haven't seen many books or articles on the varieties of bust types on the coinage of Probus, or minor variations in the fallen horseman series. Most institutions seem to be spending their effort on either die studies or grand corpus', such as the RPC. Fortunately, there is something on Gordian III that I had forgotten about! Michel Prieur organized Gordian's coinage at Rome for CGB's Rome VII sale. http://www.cgb.fr/monnaies/rome/r07/index.html Your coin: Rome mint, 1st emission, 6th officina. Struck May-December AD 238.
The number of big collections either missing the Victory Antioch or having a coin I'm not certain is Eastern is large. I still believe that the OP coin is Rome mint.
I would assume as much doug, that mine is from Rome. It looks similar to the above coin posted coin by Ardatirion, but the face of Gordian III is a bit different, as is Victoria's dress and some other minor die differences. The closest photo I can find to my example is this first one listed as Rome mint, RIC 5. and even this doesn't look too close... The letters on the reverse don't quite line up the same, and the obv titles are a bit bolder, but the portrait looks the most similar of the ones I have found from Rome.... but I still haven't yet found any that are at all more similar to the one I have.... it's an interesting portrait of him.
New Photos - My Gordian III Ar Antoninianus Okay, tried to get some new shots, I didn't really feel like removing it from the 2x2 I have it in right now, so, this is as good as I could pull off, I think it shows the portrait a little better, slightly larger and at a slightly different angle at the least... not exactly easy shots to get.
