I've mainly tried to stick to silver coins but with India i made an exception being intrigued by some of the copper coinages of the Princely States. Here's a couple of slugs of copper. The first is a copper paisa from Jaipur under Maddo Singh minted somewhere between 1760 and 1775 I believe. It is a good bit smaller in diameter than my Krause states, which makes me think that it is a half paisa but Krause does not list one (?). It is rather thick (approx 6-8mm) and its condition is a good bit better than the scan would have you believe. The second is a copper `Takka' from Jodhpur and circa 1806. It is the size of a rupee and twice as thick. The obverse has been struck off flan, but the reverse is a pretty good centred strike.
Nice coins, how rare are they ?? I have a mini collection of post EIC coins, including a BU 1880 rupee , which I got pretty cheaply !
I don't the ones i've posted are particularly rare or `valuable'.....at least not in cash terms. I just find it interesting to note that they have considerable `heft' to them. The quantum of copper gives the feeling that they are of value....significant. Compare that with the stuff we in the west use as coinage today.... Indian coinage has been (IMHO) one of the cheapest ways to seriously study variations / mints...and a whole host of other things. You could easily get lost in the scope available to you through Indian numismatics..... and not regret it. If you have Brit Empire type coinage (Victoria, Edward VII and George V / VI) it is certainly worth holding on to and expanding upon. Tides are beginning to turn though, and I suspect that `cheap' Indian coins are going to be a thing of the past in the not too distant future. However, if i were any good at predicting the future i'd be a lot richer than I am.
Ian, there are so many Indian coppers which are not listed on Krause.. A slight variation in the script can change the words in those coins.. So, keep your eyes open while collecting those coins.. Also, try to learn the Persian script (evenif you learn, it wont be easy to read what is in the coins.. but it will definitely help). Its almost impossible to find excellent pieces of these coppers unlike the silver coins. For example, the major source of Travancore dump coins is a river which flows through the extreme south of India. The sand on the river bed is home to thousands of these coins. Usually, the sand quarry workers find these coins and sell these to local dealers. So, all of them will be worn out and very rarely a coin escapes the forces of nature. Silver coins on the other hand were hoarded by people in the past and thats why these coins are seen in excellent condition even now.
True. Fascinating stuff! i don't have any `dump' coins from travancore, but I do have a few cash coins and chuckram. I'll try to scan them later today. In the interim here's three more `dump' type coppers. The first is a `Falus' from Awadh (KM140) dated AH1234 (1819 I think). The second is a `Paisa' from Chamba (KM10) circa 1844 under Sri Singh. The third is a real `dump' type coin...or rather a `dub' from Hyderabad circa 1868. A very crudely fashioned chunk of copper with some script.
Heres a few travancorean coins: 1 cash (6mm x 7mm)issued under Rama Varma VI from 1885 - 1895. 1 cash (11mm) issued under Bala Rama Varma II from 1938 -1949. 4 cash issued under Rani Parvathi Bai in 1815 4 cash issued under Rama Varma VI. This type issued 1901-10. 4 cash issued under Rama Varma VI. This type issued 1906 -35. 8 cash issued under Rama Varma VI. This type issued 1901-10. This one has a nice cud above `cash'. 8 cash issued under Rama Varma VI. This type issued 1906 -35. 8 cash issued under Bala rama Varma II. This type issued from 1938-49. copper `chuckram' KM32a. i think this is a 1938 issue (?) ...one in silver for luck! A tiny silver `chuckram' (6mm - 8mm) issued under Rama Varma IV (1860)
Ian, I'm not sure about that 4 Cash of Parvathi Bai (about its denomination). Can you let me know its diameter?
I think thats a '2 Cash' coin not a '4 Cash'. A '2 Cash' in that condition can fetch you around $25 very easily now..
(?) I'm having some difficulty with that. Bear with me. It seems to fit in pretty well indeed with the image of KM 11 in my copy of krause (2nd edition), and appears to be too large by far for the 2 cash coin noted there (KM10) which seems to be 11 - 12mm diameter. To be honest, I don't think that it could be anything other than a 4 cash coin. However you probably have better reference books on the subject than I have. As an aside, my KM has the values of the 4 cash type coin higher than that of the 2 cash, but it is a few years out of date. Would a higher resolution image be of any help? Ian
Biju, my scales are not overly reliable, so I suggest an error margin of .1 of a gram to be safe. This coin weighs in at 2.3 gms, so lets say it could be anywhere between 2.2 and 2.4 gms The flan is ovaloid in shape, and the strike appears to be off centre.
Thats definitely a 2 cash coin.. I've noted 2 different varieties of them.. One is a thick and relatively smaller coin and the other is a thin variety which is a bit larger. It seems you've got the large one. A 4 Cash coin will weigh more than 5 grams ( I dont have a scale with me.... sorry). The 4 cash coin is very scarce now and I've seen only one coin for sale all through my collecting mania and I bought it... though not in better condition.. :smile
The 8 Cash coin of Parvathi Bai can fetch you around $1200 in any condition... here in Trivandrum !!!!!
Sadly, I don't have that one......bummer!! I'm still in a bit of a puzzle (and fascinated) over that 2 (4) cash coin. It's not that I doubt you in the slightest, it's just that the only reference I have is Krause and image /size wise it's a match for KM11. We both know that KM is far from perfect, but if I accept your data then they have got KM 11 terribly wrong. Do you have any reference for the 2 cash of 15mm diameter that you mention? There has to be one somewhere (?) I'll try to find someone with a copy of Pridmore's works and see what he says on the matter. Ian
Ian, collectors here in Trivandrum got some 10 to 15 varieties not listed on the Krause.. I think, I myself will get the 'large 2 cash' very soon. And, sadly, there is no reference book for Travancore Princely State other than Krause..
Ian,that 1 Chuckram is a Rama Varma VI type,but Krause wrongly dates it as having been issued in 1927-28,which is actually during the reign of Maharajah Bala Rama Varma II (1924 - 49/91). Biju,there is a series of British Commonwealth coin catalogues called 'Coins of the British Commonwealth of Nations',which were written by a Canadian called Fred Pridmore.These are commonly known as 'Pridmore' for short.Ian could be referring to that. The late Jerome Remick also wrote a British Commonwealth catalogue called 'Coins of the British Commonweath,1649-1971'.This lists the dump Bombay coins,including the famous Bombay Rupee of King Charles II of England & Scotland (reigned 1660-85). Aidan.
Some really nice Indian copper coins, Ian. Specially the one from Awadh. The copper coins of Awadh are scarcer then the silver rupees from this state. Yes the date on this one is AH 1234. It has a very nice 'Coat of Arms' design of Awadh state. Regards Ballabh Garg
On reverse, the legend reads the title of 'Victoria Empress', so the date has to be after 1877. Now on other side the date is off-flan. So, this coin was minted sometime between 1877 to 1901. Regards Ballabh Garg
