I'm going to take the plunge and try cleaning some ancients - looking for any advice

Hey everyone. So while I am making my first purchase of ancient coins from someone trustworthy I have also been browsing various sites about ancient coins online.

I'm afraid I've caught a healthy portion of the uncleaned coins bug. I am aware of the problems with it but understand that and am still excited.

I guess my question is whether anyone has any secrets or tips that have worked for them? I have done a lot of research so am aware of at least the basics (distilled water and a toothbrush is the way to go at first).

Also, does anyone have any good dealers they can recommend on ebay or elsewhere (or any ones to avoid)? How about the below site? I am pretty sure this guy is one of the leading authorities on uncleaned coins. Is the large coin for $15 a terrible deal as a splurge?

http://www.dirtyoldcoins.com/shop/Uncleaned-Roman-Coins.html

Thanks guys I'm excited!

 

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Ummm, You might want to skip the toothbrush at least at 1st. I would recommend a good rinse in distilled water to take of any loose dirt, rinse, rinse and rinse again. If the coin still remains too dirty you might consider a soak in high grade pure mineral oil, they recommend olive oil on alot of sites for this soaking, but in my own experence I've found the olive oil to at minumum to greatly darken the surface of bronze coins the mineral oil in my experence seems to do less damage to the patina of the coin. Soaking in oil is a very slow process and can take weeks or months but when compared to the results i got with the toothbrush method, it is well worth the wait time. Also note that these "uncleaned" coins have been picked through about 1/2 a dozen times at least before they got to your dealer and with even todays cheapest metal detectors you can bet there will be no silver or gold coins in your lot unless planted there by the dealer himself.
Cleaning those coins can be alot of fun and very educational just don't expect to find any real treasure and you'll be ok

 

OK thanks for your advice. Most of the sites I've seen have said to soak in distilled water, and every day or two take them out, brush them, and replace the water. Are you saying the toothbrush can do damage to the coins?

I know I'm not expecting too much. I'm generally going to be buying the encrusted coins so hopefully there will at least be a chance of some decent stuff since they can't cherrypick something if they don't know what it is But yeah, I'm doing it more for fun than anything else.

 

I found with some that i had in the 1st batch i did, because of corosion the "details" that were 1st visible actualy crumbled off the coin when brushed (I used a very soft childrens toothbrush) While those soaked in the oil and rinsed shed the dirt and left much better details. Here is one of the best i got out of the oil soak method.



edit: On a side note this coin is again in a oil soak hoping to remove the remainder of the crud.

 

OK got it. I appreciate you helping me out here. So by rinse, rinse, and rinse again what exactly do you mean? So - I put my coin in some distilled water. 24 hours later I take it out. By rinsing, do you mean I take it out, replace the old water with new water, and put the coin back in it and just repeat that? Or do you do something else when you take it out (dry it, etc.)?

Also, can I get pure mineral oil at the grocery store? Is it expensive, and is there a brand or do I just ask someone where the high grade pure mineral oil is?

 

I'm very new to ancients myself, I see you following almost the same path I did, Just trying to help you avoid some of the mistakes i made getting started

As for the rinse rinse rinse, I used a pair of teflon tipped tweezers and after a short soak would "shake" the coin moving it through the water and would change the water to let it soak a little longer and "shake" it again. I also found the cautious use of a toothpick to "pry" a bit at the tougher clumps helped as well. Again these were like yours "uncleaned" ancients and for the price of about $1-$2 ea, I wasn't so much worried about damage, I was using them to learn the methods that worked best for me. I hope my experence can help you a bit too.
Finaly after playing around with a few batches of these I found that some very nice silver and silvered ancients can be bought fairly cheaply ($20 range) and once I get a little more comfortable with them (lots more reading to do) I will start buying good problem free examples (or the best I can afford anyway) that way, it may not be as much fun, but it results in nicer coins in the collection (just my opinion)

 

OK great thanks for your help. Now I just need to win this lot of twenty coins I bid on. Auction ends in 2 hours.

 

Ugh your getting them on ebay? Probably the worst area to get uncleaned ancients. Most are slugs and junk.

 

From what I've read it is as good a place as any, depending on the vendor.

Where do you suggest? I'm not worried about one purchase; I'm probably going to make many more.

 

These are a bit better.

http://www.forumancientcoins.com/catalog/roman-and-greek-coins.asp?vpar=1336&pos=0#Roman Uncleaned

 

Check out the for sale area of CoinTalk, Medoroman has a killer deal for some ancients.

 

I would advise you to skip cleaning all together. Even the coins from the good sellers are cruddy and common these days. You will never find a truly nice coin that way. I know you're probably seeking the rush of uncovering something new, but believe me, that same joy can be found when you merely identify an already cleaned coin.

Of course, that's not to say that cleaning can't be fun and rewarding. If you do it purely for the mechanical pleasure, its great. Kind of like picking a scab.

 

From the coins I have seen the last 8 years, "uncleaned coins" have really went down in potential. Hate to be an "old man" but you used to get truly coins fresh from the field with a couple of sellers. You really did have a chance at some good coins. I got a group once that had many small Cleo VII bronzes in there. About 7-8 years ago the pickers got way stingier, and the vast majority of uncleaned coins nowadays are major problem coins, or simply uncleaned low quality late romans.

For that reason I completely stopped buying "uncleaned coins". They just are a bad buy, when you can get precleaned coins pretty inexpensively. At this point, I cannot in good conscionce recommend buying uncleaned coins. Group lots, though, can still be interesting, but just but them precleaned.

Chris

 

I have done a lot of research on this and agree with what you guys are saying.

I understand how you're not going to find any gems or whatnot and will probably end up breaking even give or take in the long run (give or take some % and also minus your time). So believe me I'm not going into this thinking it will be a windfall.

However, I'm going to at least give it a shot for two reasons:

First I think it will be very good for me for analyzing and identifying coins. I'm still going to get the books and read them etc. but I think sitting down with half a legend or whatnot and having to attribute the coin myself will be the best way to learn quickly. Hands on do it yourself experience just seems more effective than reading.

Second it seems fun! It's probably the second closest thing to being on a dig, and starting with a lump and ending up with a "somewhat decent" coin at the end seems great. I know a lot will end up being nothing but from what I've seen you will get some 5-10 dollar ones out of it and that is fine.

I still will be collecting but it seems kind of pointless to really be buying until I have a clue what is going on. This will be a good bridge to get my feet wet and have fun in the meantime.

It also seems relatively low risk high reward. If I do it once and don't like it, that's fine. I'm out the price of one real coin and a little time. If I do like it. then all the better!

BTW here is the first lot I bought. Horrible choice? It seemed like the right mix of not total slugs but not too good so very easily ided and cherry picked. No chance of anything?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/3-Days-20-U...281026692261?ssPageName=ADME:B:EOIBSA:US:3160

 

^That lot seems better then some of the others offered. Some already look as good as they will get. But we all have our collecting strategies. Hopefully you learn and enjoy it

 

Looks like a decent lot to me you have some nice larger coins as well as some of the smaller ones. Again if your doing this for the fun and learning experence you really can't go wrong for 20 bucks. I think too many people here are so tied up in the "value" of the coins they forget all about the fun/enjoyment factor.

 

I think thats more the U.S. collector community. People like me, Dougsmit, Randy, Chris*medoraman* and others dont collect for value.

I know I have more fun with ancients then I ever did with U.S. When I collected U.S. I always felt ashamed of owning a coin that was cleaned, scratched or common. With ancients it doesnt matter near as much.

Fun & learning is more the focus with ancients then U.S. IMO

 

Not value, but more long term desire. Listen, collect any way you want, but some of us who have been doing this quite a while are simply saying buying coins in nice collectible condition is always preferable, since 10 years from now you will still enjoy those pieces. Low grade, corroded coins are fine to learn on, but at a point after you have learned on them, you won't like them that much anymore.

Just some "oldtimers" trying to pass along advice is all.

Chris

 

There is good variety in that lot, but none of them look like they can be improved much. Still, I'm sure you'll have fun with them! Especially if you start with low expectations.

Enjoy!

 

Thanks guys I appreciate the support and will keep you updated as I make progress (hopefully).