I know what the L means but where does it come from?

Almost all Alexandrian tetradrachms and some other Greek language coins use an L-shaped symbol to mean "year." Such as this inscription on a tetradrachm of Nero and Claudia Octavia:



The L is larger than the Γ (gamma, being the third letter of the Greek alphabet is used for the number 3) and may not represent any word at all, but I'm curious if anyone knows how this symbol came to represent "year." L isn't even a letter in the Greek alphabet and the Greek word for year is ETOC (ἔτος), so I don't think the symbol is derived from a Greek word.

Any idea where this symbol comes from??

 

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Hmm, that's a good question. The extent of my knowledge on the subject comes from Emmett's book, which says what you've already stated.

I have a few other books on Roman Egyptian coinage. I'll see if they shed any light on the L.

 

i was expecting to have that answered in the sayles book on provincial coins, but same thing....not known. i assumed it was some bit of fairly common knowledge that i just didn't know.

looks like i'm in good company.

 

From 'Historia Numorum: a Manual of Greek Numismatics'. Oxford: 1887; 2º ed. London, 1911, by Barclay Vincent Head, p. 718.

 

Plant says it's derived from the demotic character for "year." I don't know what that character is - I've tried to find it without any success. The Oriental Institute at the University of Chicago is compiling a demotic dictionary, but I haven't figured out how to use it - I've only glanced through it. Here.

 

Hmm, so maybe the "L" merely connotes a "numeral" rather than "year"? The original question still remains.

Sounds like a fun rabbit hole! See ya later

 

Hmm, I think that site is over my head and doesn't mesh with my coin interests.

John, can you tell me why you think the L on these Alexandrian coins might derive from ancient Egyptian demotic script? I browsed a few pages of their database and the characters all seem very, uhm, "squiggly" (script-y; cursive) rather than sharply angular like the "L" on Alexandrian coins. Maybe there is some character that fits, but I don't see any real way to search other than by downloading each section and scroll-scroll-scrolling through the vast pages.

Maybe something will turn up though. Perhaps the blocky L is a (relatively) modern derivative from ancient Egyptian demotic script?

 

I don't know anything about it. The reference to demotic is by Richard Plant in Greek, Semitic, Asaitic Coins and How to Read Them. He does not provide a picture of the demotic character he refers to, which is why I went looking for it. I also found that site over my head.

 

Odd. I have that edition of B.V. Head (and I would suggest anyone who collects Greek to buy it), but that passage does not appear in the work. Pg. 718 refers to Cilician coinage. The image you show seems to be a PDF of some other work by Head, not of Historia Numorum. Regardless, I have below an image of the relevant passage from that work, and he simply refers to the 'L' as a 'symbol' and refers to page 847 (ultimately where the info. John noted comes from). I would suggest that the L is not a letter but an Egyptian symbol (or hieroglyph, I dont know and have no time to look that up!):

 

Interesting question! I flipped very quickly through the intro to Milne's Catalogue of Alexandrian Coins, and found nothing. Sear's intro to Greek Imperial Coins and Their Values merely states the L is used in lieu of the Greek ETOYS on Alexandrian coins, without explaing the derivation of the L. The answer in Ken's book seems rational.

 

Yes, I only have access to a PDF of the work.

Here's a link. https://books.google.com/books?id=_oFBAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA718&lpg=PA718&dq#v=onepage&q&f=false

 

Looks like that is the original 1887 edition, not the 1911 revision (which I have and quoted).

 

BTW, one can get a copy for under $100 on VCoins. Its a bargain. When I became a dealer it was one of the few books I was advised was essential. And, of course essential to collectors. Very broad in scope.

 

Readers interested in this topic may wish to go to the posting of 1/7/18 discussion of Nero Tetradrachmas which has the question of the L symbol for dating.

 

Let's put the discussions side by side.


Additional note that the "Laing" proposal was preceded by nearly 70 years at least. Cf the second picture of text from Head's Historia Numorum in Ken's post above, about the center.

 

Yes, I see that, so combining the references I think the argument is a strong one that the "L" is a fragment of Epsilon, "E". How do two discussions get put side by side? I did not start the one of 1/7/18.

 

Perhaps in politics the strength of an argument is related to the prestige or importance of the one presenting it, but in the humanities arguments are defended by evidence. Speculative scholarly opinion is not evidence. So far all we have been given is learned opinion, but nothing more substantial.

If the timing has been right, look at the main menu.

 

I scanned and OCRed Historia Numorum. The quote can be found at http://snible.org/coins/hn/egypt.html#847