Hub and/or die production question - denticles

Discussion in 'US Coins Forum' started by KBBPLL, Mar 5, 2023.

  1. KBBPLL

    KBBPLL Well-Known Member

    I'm doing some research on a Barber era variety and am wondering where in the model/galvano to master hub to master die to working hubs to working dies process that the denticles appear. And where or how, within the die creation process, the number of denticles could change. Thanks for any insight.
     
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  3. justafarmer

    justafarmer Senior Member

    I have often wondered this myself. I lean towards the denticles being hand-engraved onto the Master Hub. The reduction lathe leaving a solid raised ring around the design then the waste removed from the ring by hand leaving the denticle design.
     
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  4. KBBPLL

    KBBPLL Well-Known Member

    @justafarmer thanks, I suspect the same. The specific situation is the Cuba 1915 star peso "no dots" variety (NGC calls it No Periods). You may have read the recent BCCS article. I've found that there are two types of the No Dots variety, with some letters repunched on both the obverse and reverse, and some minuscule features seemingly polished off. This leads me to think that the repunching etc was done on a master die, or if there was only one working die to produce fakes, then directly on that die. However, the two types have different denticle counts. So even if they repunched and polished a master die, how did the denticle count change?

    There is a question as to whether this "variety" is actually a counterfeit. So it seems to be a lot of work to go through to change the number denticles when you're just sprucing up your hub/die/design.

    I suppose the rim could be blank on the die (whether master or working die), and then the denticles engraved into it. There do seem to be lathe marks in between the denticles in some images, which might be a clue.
    Denticle_zoom.jpg
     
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  5. Mountain Man

    Mountain Man Well-Known Member

    Interesting question. I've just thought they were part of the original design, so were on the original master. Others?
     
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  6. KBBPLL

    KBBPLL Well-Known Member

    I'll point out that there are changes to the denticle count in other Barber coins. For example when the quarter reverse wingtip changes occurred in 1892 and again in 1900, the denticle counts also changed.
     
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  7. Dynoking

    Dynoking Well-Known Member

    Interesting post. Watching. Please continue.
     
  8. justafarmer

    justafarmer Senior Member

    Didn't the denticle count change on the Barber Quarter obverse when the middle serif was removed from the "W" on "IGWT"?
     
  9. KBBPLL

    KBBPLL Well-Known Member

    The quarter obverse denticle count changed going from Obv1 to Obv2 in 1900 when the inner ear changed, but stayed the same going to Obv3 when the W crossbar was removed.

    Denticle_Count.JPG So that's an interesting point. The initial minor changes to both sides in 1900 also involved the denticles, but the next minor change on the obverse later in 1900 did not.
     
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