Heritage live bidding question

Discussion in 'US Coins Forum' started by KBBPLL, Aug 23, 2022.


    KBBPLL Well-Known Member

    For someone with more experience bidding on Heritage than me...

    I placed a max bid yesterday at 9:55am of $223 for a coin with a Numismedia value of $294. I was mildly interested and thought why not. I also put in a "bid protection" of 1 increment, figuring I'd go $10 more, and try that method. There were a handful of bids at that point and it stood in the mid $100 range. Immediately I was winning bidder at $185.

    At 5:17p yesterday, I received an outbid notice at $230. I decided to wait for the live auction. Around $250 was what I was willing to spend, so I figured I'd see whether it was at or above $250 when it came around live.

    The auction was this evening. My lot came on at the same $230. I immediately placed a bid to $240, was immediately outbid at $250, then I clicked "cut bid" for another half increment thinking OK, another $5 is fine.

    Suddenly it was $270 and I won it at that price.

    I have no idea what happened. It flashed past so quickly and then on to the next lot. I intended for $255 to be my max. I assumed that my "bid protection" of one increment had already been used up, but maybe that was the culprit? But if so, what happened to my $5 "cut bid"?

    Sorry for the long post but I'm trying to figure out what happened for future reference. There's no way to see the bid history on Heritage that I know of.
  2. Avatar

    Guest User Guest

    to hide this ad.
  3. ddddd

    ddddd Member

    @Mainebill @panzerman @Publius2 are a few people that I can think of that might have some experience with Heritage bidding?
    I unfortunately don't (I have only used HA as a resource for sales history).
    KBBPLL likes this.
  4. masterswimmer

    masterswimmer A Caretaker, can't take it with me

    By the tone of your post it sounds as if you'll honor the winning bid. That said, I would call HA to speak with an authority on bidding within customer service. Explain upfront that you'll be paying the winning bid but at the same time you'd like to use it as a learning experience to gain knowledge for future bidding. See what the explanation is from the horses mouth with no conjecture from anyone here possibly misinterpreting what you've written. In addition, some of their explanations might generate new questions they can answer at the same time.

    That would be my approach. YMMV
    Insider, Mountain Man and KBBPLL like this.
  5. kazuma78

    kazuma78 Supporter! Supporter

    My guess is that you and another bidder hit the bid button at almost exactly the same time so as you were touching the bid button, it was an increment higher because of a bid a fraction of a second before your bid. I've had that happen to me before. Part of the risk of live bidding if multiple people hit the bid button at the same time, it can jump multiple increments almost instantaneously.
    wxcoin, ddddd and KBBPLL like this.

    KBBPLL Well-Known Member

    I'll clarify that "what I was willing to spend" had BP factored in - was willing to spend around $300 with BP hence the $250 stated above - roughly Numismedia price which is what I typically go on despite everything going for more than that these days.

    @masterswimmer Sound advice, I was planning to respond to their "you won!" email and ask for details on the bid history, explain what I wrote above, that I'm just trying to understand the process, willing to pay the extra $18 (with BP) but...
    masterswimmer likes this.

    KBBPLL Well-Known Member

    I have that thought as well but I was certain it said I was outbid at $240 when I hit the "cut bid" button. I don't know where or when my "bid protection" kicks in so possibly by also hitting "bid" I screwed something up. I'm assuming my "bid protection" would only go one increment above my original $223 bid though. I gotta go read their stuff again I guess.
  8. GoldFinger1969

    GoldFinger1969 Supporter! Supporter

    Assuming that the bidding was rapid at that point....and especially if the item was ending....then I think it had MOVED UP by the time you placed your cut bid and that's why you bid $270. I assume it was at $265 and you bid $5 higher and thus it was $270.

    I guess someone else used a half-bid and that's how it got to $265...unless someone bid $265 which was $15 over $250....and then right before that bid hit someone bid $260.

    Or something like that.....:D
  9. Publius2

    Publius2 Well-Known Member

    The various explanations are all credible. You may never know and HA may not be able to tell you. Worth asking, though. Even with a fast connection there is always some latency so that may have played a part.

    While I like the HA Live format, I still prefer a live in-person format. There just is almost no room for error when the auctioneer can see you. OTOH, if we had to rely on only in-person events, we'd miss out on 90% of opportunities.

    Good luck. I hope the experience doesn't sour your pleasure in your new coin.
    GoldFinger1969 likes this.
  10. KBBPLL

    KBBPLL Well-Known Member

    I'm already soured. Mostly mad at myself. I usually just set my max and let it go if I get outbid, but I was in the mood to buy something just to fill a hole in my weirdo type set. Last time it took them 8 days after I paid to ship it, and now this. At least with ebay you can see when bids were placed and how much, down to the last second. HA only shows x bids/bidders. This all happened in a flash and then there was the 5 second countdown with me looking at it going, wait, I bid $270?? We'll see what they say.
  11. spirityoda

    spirityoda Coin Junky Supporter

    What coin was it ?
  12. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

  13. KBBPLL

    KBBPLL Well-Known Member

    Thanks, I've read through all that a couple times. It doesn't specifically address my scenario.
  14. Pickin and Grinin

    Pickin and Grinin Well-Known Member

    Except that the live bidding jumps in 20$ increments.
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2022
  15. KBBPLL

    KBBPLL Well-Known Member

    Hmm, that's part of it I guess. I think I'll skip live bidding from now on.
  16. Michael K

    Michael K Well-Known Member

    No matter how reputable a company is, there seems to be shills everywhere,
    and no matter what you do they are always trying to jack up the price on you.
    Sure it could be an honest game and you were head to head with another legit
    buyer, but I am skeptical about anything online because there is just too much room for sketchy behavior, and if I was going to bid I would rather do it in a room where I can see the other people who are serious bidders and not just shill bidders.
    Signed, Dinosaur from the previous century when everything was better than it is now.
    masterswimmer likes this.
  17. Mountain Man

    Mountain Man Supporter! Supporter

    Please do let us know when you've gotten an answer from HA.
  18. baseball21

    baseball21 Well-Known Member

    Its literally in the terms that auction houses can bid on material they want to buy. Simply being in a room with other bidders changes nothing. Ever heard of the joke of bidding against the potted plant at the back of the room during live auctions?

    If anything theres more collusion among bidders agreeing to divvy up lots amongst each other to lower the prices and competition if its just a single room bidding auction. Whether there is live bidding or not the major houses have online and phone etc as options not just the people in the room.
  19. Mainebill

    Mainebill Bethany Danielle

    It’s happened to me. Usually if I’m live bidding it’s on a coin I really like. So I don’t mind going a little over. If I’m just buying for inventory I’ll just leave a bid and be done with it. As I need a certain amount of resale. But the coins I usually like for myself. Just chuck the price guide out the window. I bid until I get it or I decide enough it’s not worth any more to me
  20. KBBPLL

    KBBPLL Well-Known Member

    OK, you were very close to correct. HA responded. My mistake was not realizing that bid increments jump to $20 during live bidding for the $200-499 range, as pointed out by @GDJMSP , and thus a cut bid was $10, not $5. My bid at $230 brought it to $250, somebody else did a cut bid to $260, my cut bid took it to $270. For the bid increments to double like that during live bidding, especially in the low $200 range, is a ripoff. I'll avoid live bidding on HA from now on.
  21. Barry Murphy

    Barry Murphy Well-Known Member

    $20 bid increments at the 250 range is actually normal to slightly low for most live auctions. I see $25 at most auctions I attend and over the years I’ve attended 1000’s of auctions. Most jump to $50 at 500 and $100 at $1000. If the increments are too small the auctions take forever.

    Barry Murphy
Draft saved Draft deleted

Share This Page