Help on this 1928 Buffalo Nickel

Discussion in 'US Coins Forum' started by mikenoodle, Jun 9, 2016.

  1. mikenoodle

    mikenoodle The Village Idiot Supporter

    Yesterday, this shop owner I know took in this Buffalo Nickel and asked me to look at it.

    The surfaces are strange and unlike any I have ever seen.

    The luster is similar to that of a coin that has possibly been plated, but the details belie that fact, they are sharp.

    There appears to be raw (unalloyed) copper peeking out of the coin on the buffalo's shoulder, and on the Indian's feathers.

    Normally, I would assume PMD or copper plating, but if that were the case, the copper would have worn from the high points and remain in the recesses. this coin exhibits the exact opposite.

    Is it potentially an improper alloy?

    Does that command an interest within the error community?


    Thanks in advance for your help. image.jpeg image.jpeg
     
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2016
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  3. Insider

    Insider Talent on loan from...

    Your coin is POLISHED. IMO, the copper you see is from an improper alloy mix - the same thing that causes "woodies" on cents.
     
  4. SuperDave

    SuperDave Free the Cartwheels!

    Interesting. The plating process won't affect sharpness - electroplating is only molecules thick and not capable of changing the features. An incomplete/improper plating process could look like this. I'm not sufficiently expert on the topic of Buffs to opine whether a poor alloy mix could result in this look, and am interested in what the next posters have to say. :)
     
  5. cpm9ball

    cpm9ball CANNOT RE-MEMBER

    My first thought is that this Buff has been buffed.

    Chris
     
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  6. ken454

    ken454 Well-Known Member

    been cleaned and is now re-toning...
     
  7. C-B-D

    C-B-D Well-Known Member

    agreed
     
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  8. Insider

    Insider Talent on loan from...

    :facepalm: ONLY IF the nickel was first plated with copper and then incompletely plated so that the copper plating shows through! IMO, 99% Not the case here. :cigar:
     
  9. Insider

    Insider Talent on loan from...

    Buffalo nickels DO NOT "re-tone" with shiny copper colors!
     
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  10. ken454

    ken454 Well-Known Member

    FYI.. you will not see the copper in an alloy mix...on nickels, improper alloy mix shows as dark parallel lines
     
  11. Insider

    Insider Talent on loan from...

    Thanks for this bit of misinformation.:facepalm: I have learned over the years that one should never use absolutes when teaching about coins.

    While you are correct that most streaks on nickel coins are shades of brown... When the patch of copper is large enough and on the surface it can turn BRIGHT, SHINY, copper color (as seen on this piece) WHEN THE COIN IS POLISHED. BTW, when dip is put on one of these spots it turns DULL PINK. :happy:



     
  12. cpm9ball

    cpm9ball CANNOT RE-MEMBER

    I will absolutely take your coins if you give them to me.:happy::happy::happy::happy::happy::happy::happy:

    Chris
     
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  13. mikenoodle

    mikenoodle The Village Idiot Supporter

    What confuses me about this coin is the copper color is not restricted to high or low points in the design.

    We're it plated, the wear would have removed the plating from the highest point, the shoulder, but I see it prominent on the shoulder and in stretches onto the fields of the coin in protected areas.

    How can that be?
     
  14. Insider

    Insider Talent on loan from...

    Easy! It is not plated, it is polished. Wherever the copper was on the planchet it shows up on that part of the struck coin.
     
  15. mikenoodle

    mikenoodle The Village Idiot Supporter

    it makes sense, but why would the polishing expose the copper? Why would it not just look like polished nickel on the surface?
     
  16. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    I readily agree the coin has been polished. I also agree that Buffs, especially polished Buffs, don't re-tone - any color - toning requires luster be present, and polishing removes any luster.

    And I do not think the coin has been plated, but I can't categorically say it hasn't been. To me, the coin looks like it was first polished, and then given a "wash" to create that coloration. Not that they were trying for that distinct coloration, merely that it happened to work out that way due to whatever chemicals, and possibly even some powdered copper, that was mixed into the wash solution.

    And for those don't know, a wash is completely different from plating. It is a very old and very common practice, first used by counterfeiters hundreds of years ago, and today more commonly used by coin doctors. It is a liquid solution of chemicals and elements thoroughly mixed together so that when a coin is dipped into the solution, some of the elements present in the solution stick to the coin to make it appear as something it is not.
     
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  17. Pickin and Grinin

    Pickin and Grinin Well-Known Member

    If it was polished. Wouldn't that mean that the copper color that is showing is the core?. Wouldn't it leave some kind of line? Like a lamination?
    The copper color seems to fade from the high points.
    I would have to agree with the cleaned theory.
    Although I would be interested to see it in hand, then possibly a holder
    Which grading company is the hardest on Questionable color?
     
  18. mikenoodle

    mikenoodle The Village Idiot Supporter

    It's a nickel, not a cent, there is no core

    The coin is made from an alloy of 75% copper and 25% nickel
     
  19. Pickin and Grinin

    Pickin and Grinin Well-Known Member

    I understand and you are right.
    I was just thinking out loud. Could some of the copper not have mixed with the nickel.
    And there is some lustre that the Photo is not showing.
     
  20. Insider

    Insider Talent on loan from...

    The copper is on the surface. That is why we can see it. Polishing made it shiny.
     
  21. Insider

    Insider Talent on loan from...

    Need to disagree. Polished coins DO tone over time. In my experience the process often takes longer because the polishing makes the surface less vulnerable to the environment. Furthermore, the amount/originality of luster on a coin has nothing to do with whether it will tone; however, any luster present will usually make the toning more attractive.
     
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