Guess it's time to throw in the grading towel...

Discussion in 'What's it Worth' started by Kevinfred, Jul 26, 2012.

  1. Kevinfred

    Kevinfred Junior Member

    I'm officially lost.. In trying to learn how to grade, I've bought various coins in various grades. Looking at this coin in real life is even worse - much worse. I just don't see how this could be an MS coin, much less an MS61.
    I thought I understood weak strike, but this obverse looks flat-out worn down!

    Sorry to bug you all again,

    Lost

    P.S. After looking at the post, it's astonishing how much better my simple scans look than real life... wow....
     

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  3. LostDutchman

    LostDutchman Under Staffed & Overly Motivated Supporter

    AU61 at it's best.
     
  4. gbroke

    gbroke Naturally Toned

    Look like a weak strike with some bag marks. I can see it as an MS61. Which is not a good grade for any unc Morgan.
     
  5. desertgem

    desertgem Senior Errer Collecktor Supporter

    Even great photos such as these are not usually enough to differentiate a MS point or so. I see it as a possible MS-61, but barely. Most of the luster is free from breaks, without a scope I couldn't see it there were actual wear lines in the flattened area above the ear or eagle breast. If it was graded AU58, I would probaably accept that also unless it was mine :)
     
  6. medoraman

    medoraman Supporter! Supporter

    OP, what this dealer shorthand, (no offense LD), means is AU coins are now being graded MS61-63. Your grading skills are not wrong, its the fact that PCGS and NGC are now slabbing AU coins as MS, and they are not that shy about admitting it.

    I will stop before someone again accuses me of bashing TPGers. :( You draw your own conclusions from these facts.
     
  7. jcakcoin

    jcakcoin New Member

  8. Peter T Davis

    Peter T Davis Hammer at the Ready Moderator

    Yea, I guess the grader was thinking it's just a weak strike instead of wear.
     
  9. rickmp

    rickmp Frequently flatulent.

    Until you show where and when PCGS and NGC made any statement admitting what you allege, you have not presented facts, you've presented opinion.
     
  10. medoraman

    medoraman Supporter! Supporter

    I have posted before about how a TPG grader wrote a NN article outlining this entire process, stating that, (to paraphrase), "All TPG now grade coins that used to be graded AU as MS 61, 62, sometimes even 63 as a matter of course. MS 60 really is not used any more".

    The article appeared about a year and a half ago, and I started a thread about it here. I am sure Doug remembers the thread.

    That is the foundation in which I am stating what I stated, and I do not believe it is simply my opinion.

    Chris
     
  11. Kevinfred

    Kevinfred Junior Member

    Funny thing is I private mailed a poster saying that I CAN NOT differentiate PCGS AU50, AU58, etc. with this particular coin (and others I own)

    Not knowing anyone in real life to turn to - I've had to use books, internet, and graded coins to try and learn how to grade somewhat effectively. I don't have someone standing next to me saying, "This is luster break... This is wear... etc. etc."

    All I really want to do is establish which coins I have that are UNC and which are not. PCGS hasn't made it ANY easier.
     
  12. Kirkuleez

    Kirkuleez 80 proof

    How long have you been trying to learn how to grade Kevin, it takes many years to be decent. But if you grade this dollar as an AU-55, I and (I suspect) many others would agree. Don't think that you can't grade based on that coin. I have huge respect for NGC and PCGS, but I very often disagree with their grades.

    The best way to see if your coins are uncirculated is to check for breaks in luster. Hold your coin and turn it slightly to see the "cartwheel". Then check for breaks in the luster on the high spots. If there are no breaks in the luster, your coin is MS. It is truly that simple.
     
  13. medoraman

    medoraman Supporter! Supporter

    Btw, here is the thread Rick I was referring to. Anyone is free to look up the article from NN.

    http://www.cointalk.com/t130595/

    Btw I would encourage those who haven't read this thread to read it. It started off slow, (too much posting by me), but once real experts started chiming in I believe it was a very worthwhile thread. The article link is posted in the thread about 3 pages in.
     
  14. medoraman

    medoraman Supporter! Supporter

    Maybe sign up for next year's grading class at the ANA summer seminar? I bet any of us would learn a lot in that course, and you get to spend a whole week with other collectors talking coins!
     
  15. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    It looks worn down because it IS worn down.



    Ahhhh, so unless the day comes that they publicly admit that they have changed and loosened grading their grading standards - that means that it simply has not happened. That it is not true.

    Horse puckey !

    That's like saying that a guy who robbed a store, had his face and the entire robbery video taped, left behind his DNA and his fingerprints, is innocent just because he does not admit that he did it.

    The proof and the evidence that the TPGs have loosened and changed their grading standards is the printed grade right there on the slabs and on the coins within those slabs.

    Now if some people wish to deny that, fine go right ahead. But the rest of us will choose to believe what we see with our own eyes ;)
     
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