eBay Ripoff Report1 - n777mwood

This is a follow-up to my initial thread called "The Classic - 1880 $50 Franklin"
This one instance is the tip of the iceberg.

I called eBay and gave them the Before and After Auctions URL's and they agreed that it was "wrong" and said they would investigate. Unfortunately, all they did was to send n777mwood a "Note is not as Described" email with no info about what he had done.
He's smart - he refunded the money. Why risk a $100,000+ annual income that is made by heaping nearly worthless Notes on unsuspecting People ? Pay the $2800 and carry on !!! eBay loves the revenue so they won't really investigate.

Now maybe - just maybe - if enough People reported n777mwood he could be stopped . . . but like any boiler room operation he would resurface with a new ID.

Greed and corruption is everywhere. But in this case eBay has rolled out the Red Carpet to ANYONE who wants to make $100,000 or more a year by doctoring rare Currency. They don't even have a rule against it.
So all we can do is post up the facts.

As you know I am a rookie and although sad about this - I did research as much as I could.
I did not know of all the fraud going on with unGraded Notes - I did not know about "Track and Price" software either.
Now I do but ONLY because I posted up a Note and vib0nic (thank you, thank you !!) told me about it.

I had to borrow from the wife to buy what I thought was an awesome 1880 $50 Franklin.
Only to find out I had been ripped off. This guy is good - real good - he takes hard folds with ink scraped off . . . and they vanish !! The inks are restored. Incredible - I even used a jeweler's loupe and could not see the center fold in the front anymore !!!

(click to enlarge)

 

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It truly is a shame that someone would do something llike that. I suppose it's a hard lesson learned for everyone here to only purchase notes such as these in the slab. Glad to hear that you got your money back though. I hope you left him horrible negative feedback!

 

As far as I am concerned, when he conserved or cleaned the note that makes this fraud. You were right to get your money back. This is the same point myself and others have been making about coins that if you clean or conserved a note or coin it should be stated so when you sell the item, not buyer beware. Glad things work out for you and hope you get this note again soon. Jim

 

Wow, I'm sorry to hear this happened but also glad you got your money back.. I hope you will be able to purchase another note when one comes along you like and can win~

 

I think a telephone call to the Treasury Departments, Counterfeit & Fraud Division might help.

 

How is he able to do this?

 

Simply pickup your telephone or cell phone and call the Treasury Department. 1-800-359-3898 Computer/Internet Crimes or Fraud.

 

There's been a few threads on other forums about doctored notes. I know it's greed that fuels it, but when the notes have serial numbers it's kind of obvious if it reappears in better condition that it was originally sold for that something was done to it.

 

Amazing story. I agree, they should have requirement that doctored notes be listed as such.
Good to learn you got your money back. I suspect a lot of people bought doctored notes and don't know it.

What is track and price software?

 

track and price software: http://www.trackandprice.com/samplescrcurr.html . I've been using this database for the last several months and it's saved me from buying misrepresented doctored notes on several occasions.

 

legolas,

Very glad your money was refunded!

And I echo the thanks to vib0nic for the heads up to all of us!

 

Does washing, pressing, or even trimming a note actually constitute counterfeiting? Selling such a note without disclosure certainly constitutes fraud, but I'm not sure it's the sort that Treasury would be concerned with...

 

I agree... the Secret Service has more "pressing" concerns than "pressed" notes being sold as crisp unc. Maybe coinman can give them a ring and report back to us, but I believe he'll be wasting his time.

 

Any Altering of any U.S. Currency is a case of fraud/ counterfeiting. The Internet Fraud's Division is responsible for reviewing and responding in a manner they deem appropriate. Trust in the fact that while they may not respond directly to you, they will be watching the target. Now they are not going to be sending agents out to find who is marking bills, " Where's George ".

 

Way to go!! Nice catch!

 

I'm just interested to see how one is able to restore bills like this. I would think it would be impossible.

 

I agree, isn't that doctoring? Kind of along the same lines as cleaning a coin.

 

Well, this is not counterfeiting, so we can eliminate that. It's not defacing or altering. It's basically restoration (or conservation). Trust me on this... the Secret Service is not going to even look at this guy. However, if he fails to state that the item has been restored, or attempts to sell the item as original... well, that shows intent to commit fraud. Will someone go after him for that? Probably not. But hey, I applaud your efforts to stop him from ripping off his buyers, as most (unlike the OP) will never know the history of the note they buy.

 

He didn't "restore" it in the sense of conserving it or even "cleaning" it. He doctored it up, which you can see, especially where the middle fold was just to the left of the L, as well as all the places where the original bill was. He trimmed it to rid it of all but the slightest tears at the edges, he flattened it as much as possible (ironing), but some folds are still evident, only without the wear expected at a fold, the bill has been whitened and the ink has been "refreshed" to put it mildly. The job that has been done on this is probably on a par with someone who can (if he has the tools) fake artwork. He has "refreshed" all the ink, including the ink that was rubbed away or worn away before. Hence, it is not conservation techniques at all, but "restoration" which in the case of money, probably does fall under the counterfeiting tag. If it was a coin, it would be the same as cleaning it and then replacing all the metal that was worn off, and selling it as new Uncirculated.

 

Of course he's "doctoring" it up to make it look better. I don't see this as counterfeiting, but I see it as wrongfully changing the appearance for one reason: profit.