ebay image - looks can be deceiving

There are certain sellers, one in particular, that really seem to get outrageous action on their coins. They are always raw. One of the reasons that they are able to do this is because of their imaging. There is a reason the expensive coins are raw. I believe it is because the coins are mostly problem coins.

Here is a perfect example of how a picture can hide problems, like a cleaning.

***EDIT: Please note that I purchased this coin from a seller who knew it was cleaned. I am just using this as an example. I paid "cleaned-coin" price for it.

This is the same coin taken with different lighting techniques.
I am just throwing this out there to warn people that you shouldn't judge a coin by one picture. Ask the seller to send various pictures at different angles. Especially if it is an expensive coin.

Which one do you think more people would bid on?

To be clear, I took these images. The only difference between the two was the position of the lights on the coin. Imaging software was only used for cropping.

The first one uses a single direct light blasting on the coin. That is what will wash away luster. When the luster is washed away, the cleaning marks and that overall cleaned appearance go with it. Actually when it's a cleaned coin, i wouldn;t call it luster, but reflectivity or "shinyness".

The second one uses multiple indirect lights. This brings out the luster of the coin, and shows those nasty little scratches.

Vesss, I agree completely about toned coins. The darker ones being light up so much that they appear more colorful than they really are.
I think PCGS trueview is a heavy offender of this. At least with my limited experience on trueviews.


Here is the same luster situation with a toned coin.
Although this coin is high grade and uncleaned, just look at the difference lighting can make. As a toned coin buyer, I would be happy if a seller would have both types of images available. Luster is great to see, and very necessary when determining the eye apepal of a coin. At the same time, it's nice to get beyond it to see the details and the how the color sits on the coin. This also helps in determining an AT coin as well.

 

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This is why I'm hopeful that eBay follows through with allowing multiple free photos for coins. I do my best to take accurate photos of coins I sell on eBay....but like you say, you can only capture the coin so well in one or two photos...

Of course, this is why I will always take additional photos of coins if requested. But still...I'll feel more confident once multiple photos are allowed.

 

The bottom photo looks harshly cleaned,I'll go with the top photo.

 

Hey I hear you. I've sent a couple coins back because of deceptive photography. Whether it was purposely done or not, the coins were not represented true to life. Often the worst cases are with toned coins, like Morgans. Advanced photography setups can make brown look orange, dull colors look bright, etc.

As with the OP, some sellers are experts at making cleaned coins not appear to be cleaned. The above Barber looks like they messed with the contrast ratio and completely eliminated the scratch marks from the cleaning. Some setting or computer photo editor highlighted the blacks and whites and all detail was lost. After seeing the example posted here, we all should be able to spot that and know we're not looking at a good, true picture of a coin the next time we see something like that.

Another method is the usage of low light or a real yellowish colored light. I sent a LS half back one time because the auction pic made it look like an original, circulated coin. It had an antique feel to it in the pic and looked original. Once received, the details were filled with black grime and the surfaces were shiny where it had been cleaned. You could barely tell it was the same coin. So I sent it back.

Another method they like to use is blue lighting. For some reason a blue tint or hue must be pleasing to the eye in general. It gives a blue tint to the coin which will not be how it looks in hand at all. You can recognize this stuff right away if you're paying attention. Just pass on the auction.

In order to avoid these problems, it's best to know what a "good" picture is. I think there are more definitions out there than what it really is. Know what a good pic is. The next helpful picture (for the buyer of a slabbed coin) is the full pic with the slab. We all know what the slabs labels look like. If the slab label (and white rubber if NGC) has it's natural color in the same picture showing the coin, than the coin should be fairly representative of what it will look like in hand.

This is a good thread to bring up once in a while.

 

Anyone that dislikes problem coins, feel free to send them my way free of charge. I have many that get the same love as a MS coin.:welcome:

 

I think I know what seller that is. Sells lots of raw and gets plenty of action

 

Moved to my original first post.

 

The seller also ALWAYS uses black backgrounds. This helps with the contrast for even more visual trickery.

 

lol I don't think that os the point.
We all love all coins but we don't want to pay top dollar for a coin that has been damaged.

And those pictures sure make it obvious how juiced the picture was.

 

Oh I know that, when I got back into collecting in 2008 I got duped a few times. Thankfully it was some low value Brazilian coins less then $10 each. I really dont buy U.S. coins on ebay. I prefer show dealers or fellow collectors on here/PCGS boards.:yes:

 

Here's a good example I found that I still had in my photobucket account. I bought this coin last summer and a month later traded it on something else. It was an interesting toner and had received a star, but NOTHING like the seller's pic. If it really looked like this, I would've kept it.

Seller's pics:




Best possible pics I could take of it (and how it actually looked in hand)




This is a prime example of what's out there. Most of the time, the toning is much darker and not as vibrant as the seller's pics. But you can understand why they brighten them up. You have to be able to see the color patters and they get bid up higher with good pics. Bottom line: It can be risky buying/paying top dollar for toners based on pictures online.

 

Here's the half I sent back. I think this was from 2008 when I was just getting back into collecting.

Seller's pic:




My pic (reality)



The silver areas were shiny like they had been polished and I'm pretty sure the edge toning was fake. Which also was not recognizable from the seller's colorless pics.

 

Great examples Vess. With morgan toners, especially lustrous ones, it can be difficult to capture the true in hand look.

Her eis a unique Morgan. by unique I mean, although the color apepars to be dark, it actually is very vibrant in hand when the coin is shifted in normal light. Anyway, again an extreme example of lighting difference.

bad example since it makes the toning look darker than it really is. it does show off the luster though.


Bad example since the luster has been completely washed away.


Here is a decent compromise. It does show that there is luster present and shows how the color looks in hand. Well, pretty close. It does have more luster. It does need to go back to the photo studio for a re-image.

 

While this image is of low quality, it does not appear deceptive and shows an obvious cleaning. Point well made with the Morgan.


The OP's recent string of photo related threads are commendable and should be a great help to many.

 

There are many ways to make coins either more appealing or less, with light. There were times when I took pictures of my toners and saw a coin that looked completely different than mine. And sometimes it looks really bad. I don't know how many pictures ebay gives on coins for free since I never sold, but if its like other auctions it should be four, which is enough if the seller is honest.

 

True. However a lot of the motivation should be on the buyers. Most sellers will oblige when asked for more images. If they won't then you know to avoid the seller. Especially when your talking about pricey Morgan toners. And by pricey, I mean anything over melt.

 

I don't buy from GS coins anymore. the only negative feedback I ever left on the 'bay was them.

 

I never mentioned a seller. *wink

 

Just wanted to bump this up. I think it is important for buyers to read. I know the CT weekend crew is a little different a little different than the weekday daywalkers.

 

Are you implying that now that everyone's back to work that finally some CT reading can get done?