Do your homework before buying.

Prior to purchasing some Indian Head fractional Eagles, I studied quite a few examples at the auction lot preview during the World's Fair of Money in Baltimore last year. I have found that by doing this, I get a very good idea of how the coins grade and the exposure enables me to determin if coins for sale are authentic. I recommend that everyone who buys coins to take every opportunity afforded them to view all of the examples of any type coin prior to purchasing a single coin.

These relatively expensive coins can be a risky purchase even when the have been slabbed, I believe a fairly large number of slabbed coins are broken out and replaced with lesser examples, especially by the faceless sellers on eBay.

The public library is also an extremely valuable resource for studying various photos of coins, but there's nothing like holding coins in your hand and looking at then from every angle with your loupe, at your own pace.

Has anyone else utilized the auction preview as a classroom??

 

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By "Indian Head fractional Eagles" do you mean the $2 1/2 & $5 Indians (Quarter Eagle and Half Eagle respectively)?

Can you give an example of this where it would fool a reasonably knowldgeable collector?

 

o

 

OK, I mean counterfiet slabs......I have never opened up a slabbed coin ,so I don't know if the holder shatters or remains intact.




http://www.pcgs.com/articles/article_view.chtml?artid=5286&universeid=313

COUNTERFEIT PCGS HOLDERS

- March 27, 2008 In recent days, counterfeit coins in counterfeit PCGS slabs have begun to appear on eBay, the online auction site. All of the counterfeit coins/holders seen so far are coming out of China. Alert members of the PCGS Message Boards were the first to notify PCGS of the counterfeit coins/holders.
The coins themselves range from poor-quality counterfeits to well-made fakes. The counterfeit PCGS holders are well-executed, but with minor differences from a genuine holder. PCGS anticipates that authentic coins will eventually be placed into counterfeit PCGS holders in the future, perhaps with elevated grades and/or inappropriate designators (Full Bell Lines, Prooflike, etc.), although none have been seen to date.
The on-line PCGS Certificate Verification is a method for confirming that a particular certificate number matches the information in the PCGS database, but the counterfeiters are aware of this detection method and are now using valid certificate numbers (see below).
PCGS has contacted U.S. governmental agencies, including the FBI, U.S. Customs, the Secret Service, and US Postal authorities, to enlist their assistance in pursuing enforcement or legal remedies against these counterfeiters. Also, PCGS is a member of eBay's CCW Group, which monitors eBay for fraudulent listings and asks eBay to discontinue auctions of suspicious coins and/or suspend violators.
PCGS has called for eBay to stop accepting listings of any rare coins from Chinese sellers. Ebay recently pulled several auctions of counterfeit coins/holders at the urging of PCGS.
PCGS urges consumers not to purchase rare coins from Chinese sellers on eBay. While legitimate, authentic coins exist in China, the plethora of fakes and fraudulent listings on eBay increase the likelihood that coins purchased from Chinese sellers will be counterfeit.
The PCGS Guarantees of Grade and Authenticity do not apply to counterfeit holders, but PCGS has a strong interest in assisting consumers in actions against any fraudulent sellers.
Sufficient differences exist between genuine and counterfeit holders such that PCGS experts can easily identify fake holders. Consumers are cautioned that coins that appear to be underpriced may be counterfeit. PCGS urges all consumers to deal only with reputable sellers who are willing to stand behind the coins they sell.

PCGS recommends consumers consider the following any time they make a coin purchase:

1. Verify the certificate number using the PCGS Cert Verification program at http://www.pcgs.com/cert/

1. 
   See limitations above
   [*]Avoid purchasing rare coins from eBay sellers in China.
   [*]Investigate the legitimacy of the seller (examine feedback; avoid low feedback sellers; find out how long the seller has been in business; do they have a good reputation?; do you have legal recourse in case of a problem?).
   [*]Make sure you have a money-back guarantee that is enforceable (for example, credit card companies will often assist in cases of fraud).
   [*]Realize that "bargains" in numismatics are usually too good to be true.
   [*]If you have a question about a particular coin, be sure to have it checked out by an Authorized PCGS Dealer or by PCGS before the expiration of any guarantees.
   [*]Request an immediate refund if the coin you purchased turns out to be a counterfeit.

The following list of coins and certificate numbers have been seen in fake PCGS holders: China (1916) Silver Dollar, Y-332, Cert #10712316 (valid)
China (1923) Silver Dollar, K-677, Cert #11354470 (valid)
China (1923) Silver Dollar, K-678, Cert #11285683 (valid)
China (1923) Silver Dollar, Y-336.1, Cert #13835186 (valid)
China Republic (1912) 20 Cents, Cert #21981173 (invalid)
China (1916) Gold Dollar, Pn-44, Cert # 11072163 (invalid)
China (1923) Gold Dollar, Tsao Kun, K-677, Cert #11354470 (invalid spec, valid cert…used above)
US 1858-O Half Dollar, Cert #03884338 (valid)
US 1800 Silver Dollar, Cert #03859118 (valid)
US 1795 Silver Dollar, Off-Center Bust, Cert #22030856 (valid)
Mexico 1761-MoMM 8 Reales, Cert #05763936 (valid)
"Valid" means that the correct information shows up under Cert Verification
To alert PCGS to any offerings of counterfeit PCGS holders, please notify Ron Guth at guthr@collectors.com. For more information, contact PCGS Customer Service at 800-447-8848.

 

I would have to agree with Hobo and GD ; it would never fool a collector and tampering with the holder would most defiantly be noticeable.

As for your 2.5 Indian it's simply beautiful, I'm sure you are very proud of it

 

I have seen 2 examples where an NGC slab has been successfully separated and then "resealed" with a different coin in it. One was an 1924 S peace dollar in MS65, and the second was an 1927 D Standing liberty quarter in 65. Wouldn't have been noticeable to me accept both coins were clearly AU's.

It was apparent after some careful studying (and sending one back to NGC) that the slabs had been cracked and resealed with glue... these were very hard to tell that they had been resealed (someone spent a LOT of time on these)... even to someone who looks at NGC slabs all day... The thing that gave it away was the sound it made when it hit the table...

Both of these coins came to customers of mine from E Bay.

they do exist.

 

The whole point of this is that if you're buying on eBay, you don't hold the coin in your hand prior to bidding - you can't possibly study the coin or the holder to see if it is in the described condition. Not everyone here is a "seasoned" collector, this forum is for the education of everyone. I am just attempting to give people a method of studying coins which they have not been exposed to or simply cannot afford.

Auction previews provide a great opportunity to handle extremely rare and valuable coins even if you don't have any intention to buy the coins. You can still hold and study a quarter million dollar gold proof coin -

 

I have heard of a few examples of slabs cracked and the coins replaced with a lower grade example. However it is far from "a large number", IMO.

 

p.s. all the more reason to INSIST on a good return policy when buying on eBay.

 

Hmm..seems the experts disagree, meaning that some experts in here must be wrong?!? I wouldn't have believed it. Very educational indeed.

 

This is very disturbing. All the more reason to be looking for those CAC stickers.

 

Thank you for reminding me again why I stopped buying on Ebay.