I have always casually collected coins but have gotten really deep into the hobby as of late. (In the last year and a half or so...) About a year ago, I purchased this 1900 lafayette commemorative dollar from Apmex advertised as BU. It has sat in a coin envelope since then and I haven't really looked at it much. Well today I decided was going to get a submission together to send to PCGS. This is one of the coins I was planning on sending in. As I was looking at it again I noticed the letters have some areas that are not fully struck. I weighed the coin (26.74 grams, in tolerance) and did the magnet slide test and it passed but I have not seen any on PCGS that have letters and dots missing spots like this one. It has satiny luster left and the devices look good compared to pcgs images but I am worried about these letters. It even has die filing marks in the fields like a genuine lafayette dollar would. Could there be an explanation for the lettering issues or are my worst suspicions infact true, Apmex sold me a fake coin??? If I knew then what I know now I would have returned it immediately. I didn't know what to look for as much back then... Now I would only purchase a coin like this already certified lol but thought Apmex was a reputable dealer nonetheless...
I don't see anything that screams "fake". But I'm not an expert on this issue. Here's mine for comparison. It's the die variety 1-B, the most common marriage. Your coin is Obverse 1 with the diagnostic being the A in DOLLAR is lower and leaning left. The reverse of your coin is Reverse A with the diagnostic being the first lower leaf is directly over the 1 in the date. So your coin is die marriage Duvall 1-A. It is estimated that only 2% of the coins in the market are 1-A so you have a pretty scarce coin. I would definitely send this in to PCGS because you will want it certified. Now, if PCGS says it's a counterfeit, then you can take that back to AMPMEX. I only have a couple of transactions with them but nothing bad to report and they have a decent rep in the collecting community.
I heard the CEO of Apmex talking on a podcast once. Might have been the Coinshow podcast with Mike and Matt (forum members here) but can't remember. What I do remember from it is that he said every piece that goes through there is tested on a scanner no matter how insignificant, in order to avoid selling a fake and maintain their integrity. Which is great for bullion and maybe even to verify this coin is right in that regard. Do they have experts on staff that could identify a Lafayette fake? You'd have to ask them. I suppose anything is possible but I don't believe they would purposely sell you a fake. They have to maintain integrity to stay in business.
The different die varieties explain a lot, but it is still very odd to me the letters are broken and incomplete in so many areas. Maybe just a striking error?
I was going to say maybe a foreign substance got into the recesses of the die when that one was made but it'd be nearly impossible for both of those Es to have nearly the exact same strike up problem. That is weird.
Yeah it is weird. It is like that in several areas on both sides. Some of the dots and stars are like that as well. Everything seems like it is a genuine coin EXCEPT for the peripheral lettering issues. But as Publius2 pointed out there are different die marriages and this is a Duvall 1-A combination. It would seem unlikely for a counterfeit to be made copying a coin with an uncommon die marriage. I almost wonder if the dies were contaminated with some substance like grease or something that caused the lettering issues?
Maybe try to find images of late die stages for this marriage. Could be die deterioration of the peripheries of the die.
Thats a good point expat, maybe the dies were deteriorating on the peripheries. I hope it is just an issue when it was struck and not counterfeit. This coin wasnt cheap and I don't think Apmex would take it back since its been about a year already. If anybody else has any opinions on what they think is going on with this coin I would love to hear what you think about it. Everything else seems pretty legit other than the lettering issue...
Anthony Swiatek in his book Encyclopedia of the Commemorative Coins of the United States relates this (regarding counterfeits) in his treatise of Lafayette dollars: "A counterfeit specimen will often display surface roughness, graininess and roundness of lettering. Look for raised metal spikes, or tooling marks, above the words "States" and "The" of the inscription, and on the reverse, examine for this defect below the letter "L" in "Lafayette". Hope that might help........
UPDATE: I have been looking for images of coins with the DuVall 1-A die marriage (which Publius2 brought to my attention) in similar die stages (as expat suggested.) I finally found one with the same die marriage and with what appears to be a similar die stage when it was struck sold in 2012 by heritage auctions graded MS-64 by PCGS. It looks to me like the two E's in "LAFAYETTE" and the second L in "DOLLAR" are beginning to deteriorate in a slightly earlier die stage than mine. I feel like the MS-64 grade is kind of generous for this coin.... I can almost say for certain now that mine is infact genuine. It just made me suspicious with the broken lettering but help from Publius2 and expat sent me in the right direction! Thank you!
The thing is these letters are recessed in the die it could be whatever foreign material was in the recesses when yours was made was starting to come out again and that coin may have been struck after yours. Or it was starting to build up on that one. Something didn't let the metal flow. Cool that you found one.
Happy to help and glad it did. Now that you're confident it's genuine, are you going to submit to TPG?
I think so... I can't believe that one got MS-64. In my opinion mine looks to be in better condition than that one... I was thinking mine might be lucky to get 62 if it even gets a straight grade at all.
If you didn't know about that die marriage being a rarer one when you purchased the coin then what a good break you got! Did APMEX list and price it as such?
That lafayette dollar of johnmilton's has really nice eye appeal. Very attractive toning, sweet coin! To answer your question Endeavor, Apmex just listed it as "1900 lafayette silver dollar commem BU" and they did not say anything about the variety.
I sent it to pcgs yesterday along with 8 other coins on the regular service level. I will update when I get the grade back (appx. 40 business days they say). I doubt they will put on the holder it is the DuVall 1-A variety but I paid for the variety service on that coin just incase. That would be really cool if they did! For now, does anybody want to guess what they think the grade might come back as????
