Crack-out?

Discussion in 'Coin Chat' started by princeofwaldo, Dec 10, 2012.

  1. princeofwaldo

    princeofwaldo Grateful To Be eX-I/T!

    Probably not the finest known, but beats me why it isn't in an MS62 holder.

    alb1938g.jpg alb1938h.jpg
     
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  3. Bedford

    Bedford Lackey For Coin Junkies

    I see a lot of light scratches in both the obv. & rev. fields. Just looks like it was improperly handled/stored .Thats probably why IMO.
     
  4. princeofwaldo

    princeofwaldo Grateful To Be eX-I/T!

    The marks wouldn't even show were it a frosty coin. Merciless grading on proof-like fields it seems, though in fairness this hardly the only coin with PL fields in my collection that has gotten whacked by the grading services.

    aus1908b.jpg aus1908c.jpg
     
  5. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    I would say they graded the 100 Frg correctly, and over-graded The Lady In The Clouds.
     
  6. Tom B

    Tom B TomB Everywhere Else

    I would suggest an in-holder regrade instead of a crack out and resubmission.
     
  7. princeofwaldo

    princeofwaldo Grateful To Be eX-I/T!

    I agree with you in a 1996 sort of way. But this being 2012 and all, why especially the 100 Franga would almost certainly move-up.
     
  8. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    Ya know, eventually enough people are going to catch on to the over-grading done by the TPGs. Knowledgeable collectors already have. And when enough of the rest do, then the TPGs will change their grading standards again and tighten standards up to where they should be. And when that happens, collectors won't be able to give away all of those coins in over-graded slabs.
     
  9. Troodon

    Troodon Coin Collector

    In my experience I've seen a lot of coins graded by PCGS that are, if anything, under-graded. Case in point the coin posted by the OP; there's no wear on it. A coin with no wear should never grade worse than MS 60.

    I will agree with you on one point though; the TPGs tend to grade coins not based on strict technical standards but on what the market would deem them to be worth. Many people on this board agree with me on this point (yet for some reason they don't view that as a problem). At some point the market may very well demand that the TPGs do what they're in theory already being paid to do, accurately grade the coins based on consistent standards rather than on some idea of how market-acceptable the coins are. One can only hope.
     
  10. frostyluster

    frostyluster Member

  11. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    I strongly disagree with that.
     
  12. Troodon

    Troodon Coin Collector

    I'll bite; where's the wear?
     
  13. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    Honestly, if you can't see it then there's no point in discussing it. But it is right where it almost always is - on the high points.
     
  14. princeofwaldo

    princeofwaldo Grateful To Be eX-I/T!

    Back when it was a raw coin, Richard Ponterio described it as brilliant uncirculated. That was around 1993. To give you an idea how conservative Ponterio used to grade, he would routinely describe slabbed coins a grade or two lower than their label in his auctions. It's part of the reason he's no longer an independent auctioneer. Why would anyone consign coins to him if he was going to whack the grade in the catalog description? As for actual wear, GDJMSP must have ESP or something. It may in fact have wear, but it's impossible to tell from the photos posted. I'd have to get the coin from the bank and look at it again. There are some scuffs in the fields, no doubt about that.
     
  15. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    I am quite familiar with how Rick Ponterio grades coins and I have bought many coins from him. And this would not be the first coin that I thought he over-graded.

    You can say whatever you want, but based on what I have to look at, my opinion will not change.
     
  16. princeofwaldo

    princeofwaldo Grateful To Be eX-I/T!

    Evolution does not favor the strongest, nor does it favor the smartest. Rather the ability to adapt to change determines natural selection.
     
  17. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    Well I'll tell ya what. If the day ever comes that they start calling mules horses, I'll still be calling them mules. Because that's what they are ;)
     
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