Contemporary Counterfeits

It seems that there are a few of us who either actively collect or at least possess some contemporary counterfeit coins.

I don't want to bore people by debating the rights and wrongs of collecting these, but simply show a few (or more than a few if there is an active interest) so that people can make themselves aware of the extent to which counterfeiting occurred over the centuries.

To start the ball rolling here's three of mine.

The first is a fake Louis XVI ecu. The silvering has obviously long since been lost, but in its day this attempt would have been VERY convincing.



The second is a george III 1817 half crown. Again, the silvering has gone, but the design detain is remarkably true to the coin it imitates. Another one which would have passed without much of a second glance in its day.



The third is a fake Bank of England 3 shilling token. Again, silvering has long since gone.



I've plenty more examples from around the world, most of which i've collected intentionally, but some of which (it pains me greatly to admit) VERY unintentionally!! To my mind while it certainly pays collectors to know their coins, it also pays them to keep alert to the fact that few coins (if any) have escaped the counterfeiters `arts' and be on the lookout for them.


Ian

 

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Here's one from my black box -

A cast imitation of a Meiji 8 (1875) Japanese silver yen. It appears to be made of a low-grade silver alloy. Besides the surface appearance, and low weight, the unnaturally wide rims give it away.

 

this is the only known fake that I own. Its a very obvious one. Domitian... bought for me as a present in Rome...PADUAN copy

 

Roy:
It is obvious to you, but equally obviously I would have been fooled.
Did you get it as a copy?

 

I think I see why it is 'obvious', but please explain.

 

I bought this from a US coin dealer's foreign coin bin in the mid 1960's.
It appears to be made of lead or something similar and was at one time plated.
The genuine coin is silver.
It is amazing that the economy in Portugal in 1954 permitted a profit on making a counterfeit coin worth around 50¢ then.

 

willieboyd:
But in 1954 that was decent money.
I once found a 1967 US quarter that was lead.
So, I guess that there is profit in anything.

 

for one thing it is a copy of a paduan medal which are fake medals, extremely nice well done medals, but they were made in the 16th century...so one could say its a fake of a fake...the one below is even a cast of an orginal and isnt a real example of the original fake...but it is cast from an original and a real good cast...the original fakes are VERY expensive collectors items now...

here is the coin it is trying to emulate:





I would be thrilled if it WAS a real paduan medal fake...here is a bit of info on them:

Paduan – By this name are designated the false medals executed with much care and with surpassing skill by Giovanni del Cavino, surnamed il paduano, and by Bassiano. These fabricators of counterfeits, who are equally distinguished by the appelation of the Pauduans, copied medals from the antique, or according to the antique method, or they composed designs for reverses with a profound knowledge of history.
These medals belong to the 16th century AD, and are held in great repute, and are still much in request on account of their beautiful workmanship. It is to the Paduans, and also the Dutchman Carteron that the greatest portion of false coins are to be ascribed, which find a place in almost all cabinets. The French King's Collection at Paris contains a fine suite of these mock antiquities.

here are more of them:

http://www.forumancientcoins.com/fakes/thumbnails.php?album=2&page=1

Now when I saw it, I was not aware of these medals...but the coin was the size of a sestersius but the weight was closer to an As...the style of the rev. is not right, generic and soft, no signs of a sharp strike like a cast of a cast fake...wrong style is something that can only be determined after seeing a lot of ancients, the portrait is nice and is common to domitian coins, the portrait is style is off and lettering is fat and soft where letter is supposed to be sharp edged from a strike, even with wear, where the letter hits the flan should be more angular |_ and instead it is blended soft like a poor cast that doesnt quite get the sharp edges....I still am not sure of what metal it is made of but it is real light weight and has white and red corrosion, seems to be almost rusting red and white (maybe zinc and aluminium)...it didnt have the weight and heft of a sestersius. On closer inspection of the coins edge I found very obvious signs of having been filed...and with close inspection I found even bubble pattern from casting...this coin had EVERY sign of a fake that one is told to look for.

 

"isnt a real example of the original fake"

That HAS to be one of the greatest sentences in the English language, ever!
Shakespear would have been proud!

 

It was advertised as genuine, despite an incorrect weight being stated in the ad, and despite the other defects which were obvious to anyone with some knowledge about the genuine coins (the wide rim, the porous surface, the lack of detail in certain areas, the calligraphy, etc.). I purchased it within my budgetary limit for fakes. The seller was one of many I have unsuccessfully "outed" to Ebay.

 

And how did you do that? Get them tossed?

Perhaps you can help Zaneman?

 

I only have a couple the 1/2 crown I posted earlier and a rather nice Morgan :smile having said that I have just thought I might have another lurking around somewhere LOL

De Orc

 

The key to my post was "unsuccessfully". Reports of fraudulent auctions are routinely ignored by Ebay and it's phoney-baloney "Community Coin Watch". :headbang:

 

Ian,I have seen a few brass fakes of the 'Bull Head' 1/2 Crown in my time.The most deceptive fake I was landed with was a fake Irish 6/- piece a few years back.Fortunately,it was an expert in the Wanganui Numismatic Society who spotted it,as I had brought it along to the annual Levin Interclub meeting to show.Fortunately,the guy who I had bought it off was at the meeting,so he did the right thing by taking it back & letting me have NZ$125 worth of British Commonwealth bank notes,as I had originally paid NZ$125 for the dud 'coin'.

There are 2 types of fake coins that would be of interest to me - the contemporary forgeries of the traders' tokens that were put into circulation at the same time as the original tokens,& the extremely scarce Connaught 1d.,which is a brass contemporary forgery of the extremely rare English King Edward VI 1/- that was released into circulation as a coin.The pink Coincraft catalogue lists the Connaught 1d. with a price (in Pounds Sterling,of course) as a proper Irish coin.

Any deceptive forgeries do not interest me at all.If someone tried to offer me what looks like a Canadian 1911 silver $1,I would reject it,as it is certainly a forgery of an extremely rare pattern coin worth several hundred thousand Dollars (both U.S. & Canadian).

Aidan.

 

I have tried to report them, now I just attempt to warn the bidders...if its a private auction, I e-mail the seller to inform him 'just in case he didnt know' that his coin is a fake...

 

Aidan, I don't have a fake Bank of Ireland 6 shillings, but I do have a real one.

I do however have a fake 1804 Bank of England dollar (and a real one). I've posted both so you can make a comparison. The fake has been deliberately made to look well circulated, and coupled with the fact that genuine coins were often crudely overstruck on their spanish peices of eight hosts, it is small wonder that fakes became a very serious problem. The silvering on the fake is nigh on intact but the copper core is showing through in places, particularly at the date.

Fake:


Genuine (with bankers mark on cheek):

 

Ian,the Bank of England $1 (really a Crown,as it is denominated as 5/-) is one coin that has always eluded me.It is a pity about that counterstamp on your example of the Bank of England $1.

About the Irish pieces,do you have the 5d.,the 10d.,& the 30d. pieces as well? The 1806 5d. & the 30d. are very difficult to find.I have a 30d. which someone engraved the letter 'J' on the King's head.

Aidan.

 

I have done the same-- used the innocent routine, never got me anywhere.
except ignored.

 

To me it adds a bit of `character'

 

Here's two fake Dutch East Indies coins. The first is a darkly toned three gulden that i'm convinced would fool most collectors. It's actually 3 grams light of the mark and slightly smaller (1/2 mm) in diameter, but other than that, scary!!

The second is a Ducaton, again a couple of grams off the mark, and still quite convincing.