Contaminated Dellars Darkner and my whacked S VDB!

Here it is: Swallow my pride and admit I keep taking this coin down further and further the path of lunacy. I should have sold it but wanted to fix it. I used Dellars Darkner after I have left in acetone too long to remove verdigris which revealed previous hairlines (I would have used Verdigone had I known about it at the time). The Dellars Darkner, somehow had to be contaminated as I used it on about 4-5 of my coins and they all spoted with carbon looking/verdigris spots raised above the surface. I used Veridgone to remove most of them and Thad is sending me more and I am confident it will remove the rest of the spots. However, this coin developed this splotchy gray look which covered a lot of the hairlines (partially) but is spreading with every attempt to remove. I soaked in MEK, then xylene for lengths of time and Verdigone. Verdigone seemed to regress the color somewhat but became saturated and I am out. So I am waiting to get to more. I had the thought of 1-2 drops of a dip (Jewelluster) in a large amount of DW. If no effect keeping adding one drop until I see a beneficial effect. I have emotionally detached from the coin somewhat and have accepted I will lose money on this no matter what. Even the junk F/VG grades go for 900-1000 K so I won't cry about it no matter what the outcome. Please no "you ruined your coin, bummer what were you thinking???, etc, etc.." I have beat myself up enough and felt pure terror when I saw the coin after the long acetone soak. Instant horror. Anyway, what's done is done. Just want useful solutions to improve the look. I plan on sticking it in my album for many years regardless and hope it develops some nice toning. :computer::hammer::hammer:

 

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Please tell me this a joke thread. Really PLEASE.

I am not a chemist nor a metallugist but after reading the torture you have put this coin through I am somehow reminded of the Spanish Inquisition.

What's next - the rack? A comfy chair?

Solution for your album? Put it in a 2x2 and tape it to the inside cover. A reminder of what you "should not do to a coin". I still have my sickly pink 1851 large cent that I destroyyed when I was about 6 or 7 years old.

 

I think you should just leave it in your album, and hope it tones. It still has great details, IMO it's still a very nice looking coin.

 

"Anyway, what's done is done. Just want useful solutions to improve the look."

Isn't that what you've been doing all along? I beg of you...just leave it alone.

 

Clembo, I guess you didn't read my post well. I didn't post for looking for any criticism. Just advice on how to proceeed if anyone has seen this gray look on a coin. In fact I used a toned down version of the Dellars by mixing in with vasoline to dilute so as to not have the toning look painted on. I actually quite specifically ask to not have your above response. If anyone else wants to post accordingly don't waste your time. Just anyone that has useful advise. Ultimately it will sit in my album and hopefully retone and look somewhat normal.:loud:

 

Ouch! My condolences. :crying: Wish I had one even in that condition.

 

Boss, you put the darkener on after the acetone? Is that the darkener that is suppose to set overnight to "harden" on the coin surface? If it is and I know at this point it is not the best suggestion as it and you have been through so much. Do you think the gray coloration might be from darkener that is still on the surface? The instructions I found said if one overdoes the Dellers,
http://www.brent-krueger.com/dellers.html
use Olive oil to remove the excess. I don't believe a day in olive oil would cause any worse condition. Your call if you think it might be the dellers.
Since they say Dellers contain sulfur, the color might already be permanent.

Jim

 

bake it in the oven and place it on a windowsill in the sun for about a year.

 

I don't understand why you'd use VERDI-GONE™ on this coin, I don't recommend that at all, I see no verdigris. The only thing VERDI-GONE™ should be used for is removal of verdigris, it's not designed for anything beyond that.

I agree with desertgem, soak it in olive oil for a few weeks, clean that off with xylene, then put it in a window sill for months to retone. Periodically rub the coin between your fingers and flip during the retoning process. This coin will probably need over a year to oxidize.

Sorry Harryj, I disagree, DO NOT BAKE THE COIN, whatever you do IMO. Heating Lincolns is a very bad idea, I've experimented with it and the results are not good. Try it for yourself and see. The zinc/tin tend to come to the surface because they have MUCH lower melting points than copper. Here's the difference:

Tin 232°C
Zinc 420°C
Copper 1085°C

Once the appearence changes to the "silvery" color, the coin is completely ruined. The alloy mix will never be the same.

 

For Jim: the color is definitely Dellars- it caused two of those spots which Verdigone removed. The more I soaked the worse it looked and the gray was spreading- soaked in Xylene and MEK. It's in olive oil now. That was my next thought.
Harry: I don't know what baking in an over would do?. I know people put coins in potatoes to draw out the bad stuff, but I am too afraid to do that. Enough damage done. I know people have soaked coins for a long-time in mineral oil and maybe a month in olive oil. I have soaked coins and they looked better.

 

Put it in a sock with a cut-up lemon, pee on it, and bury it for a year under a full moon. Might help.

Seriously, though, good luck with all this travail. I guess the above was generated by recalling how Civil War reenacters try to "old" up their brass buttons.

 

I don't think there is anything you can do to improve this coin. The damage is done and that's just the way it is. Your original post says the coin had verdigris to begin with and therefore would have been destroyed had you not taken some kind of action. Unfortunately, the initial treatment damaged the coin further (which happens sometimes...it's just part of the risk) and instead of cutting your losses there you tried to "fix" it. Well, the truth is, you can't fix it...there is no fix. Your best bet is to simply stop tinkering with the coin and accept that what you have is as good as that coin is going to be. DON'T put anything else on it.

Remember, with the verdigris this was a problem coin...so you really didn't ruin a good coin...you just changed what kind of a problem it is. Could the verdigris have been removed without further damaging the coin in the first place? Maybe, it depends on how bad it was. But, it's too late now.

What I would do is what others have said. Put this coin in a place where it will slowly tone over the next few years. Maybe that will improve it's eye appeal a little bit. But, it will always be a problem coin and therefore IMHO it will never realize the values that even the "junk F/VG grades" go for. Generally, people will pay less for one of these than they would for one of those good "junk" examples. It's just the way it is.

I don't mean to criticize you, but this is what I feel is the truth.

 

carry it with your pocket change for a couple of weeks, that ought to fix it right up.

 

What it looks like to me is the verdigris was removed and it left spots and when you used Dellers on it, the other areas reacted differently. You have 2 choices:

1. Leave it alone and give it 20 years to retone back to normal.

2. Soak it in tomato juice for an hour, then water & baking soda for another hour, rinse well and then recolor it with Dellers.

The tomato juice will remove the coating of the grey area and give you a totally clean coin and the Dellers will then color evenly.

Your best bet is the first choice but if you are in a rush to get it looking better, then #2 works but even I would not recommend it on such a valuable coin. It's one thing to clean crud off old beat up coppers but that is not an old beat up copper, but it's your call.

Ribbit

 

The coin is likely ruined. I'd sell it and get one that you like (presuming you don't like this one)...MIke

 

A tragic story indeed. On the bright side though, I see "problem 1909-s vdbs" all the time on ebay, and they still go for a pretty hefty pricetag. It seems that problems have more of an effect on coins that are conditional raritys(such as an MS-65 seated liberty quarter), than a popular coin like the 09-svdb. It still looks decent IMO, and believe it would fetch a pretty good price on the bay if you decided to sell.

 

I guess it's a good lesson about why coins should not be cleaned. One bad experience can undo many successful experiments.

 

No, quite the contrary. Look at the bright side, Boss. Now, you "know." And, nobody can tell you different. But, thinking there's a "snake oil" out there that can enable you to restore this key to any former glory it may have once had, after all that has just been said and done, is kind of like thinking you can put a drop of ink into a quart of milk, shake it up well, then pull that drop of ink out of there. Unfortunately, what's done is done. Still, though, I have to say, it really doesn't look that half bad to me...based on these pics.

 

Will there be calling hours and a burial for that poor coin? :crying:

I'm sorry, I had to say it. You know what, it's actually a good visual for some of us that just keep thinking we should do something with a coin!