Coin clipped after being struck?

How does this happen? Or is it bogus? I've never heard of this happening.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ND-Memorial-Lin...em&pt=Coins_US_Individual&hash=item27b293d64c

 

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Well if Mike Ellis is selling it I would be 150% confident in it

 

The coin appears to be being sold by Mike Ellis. At least that's the EBay name selling it. If you don't know Mike he's an error guru and currently a grader for dominion grading service (DGS). He is also a past president of CONECA and ran for an ANA board of governors position.

If this piece is being sold by Mike I have no problem with the piece.

 

If you want coin like that, make it yourself. It will look the same and only cost 1 cent.

 

I was wondering how it happened. Anyone know? His description is not very clear.

 

It appears to be his site. At least the picture matches.

 

As I understand it this error is the result of a clipped planchet that did not seperate cleanly. The cut was not clean and the piece was retained through the raising of the rim and the striking of the coin. It broke away from the rest of the coin after minting. I don't know of any way to cut the coin post mint that wouldn't show some evidence of damage made by the cut.

Richard

 

Looks real to me. Why wouldn't a crook include the date to increase the value?

 

Looks like it was an Incomplete Clip at one time. If you look at the inside ends it looks as if its a little ragged. To me thats a sign that this clip had a little help along the way. Values for an Elliptical Clip are about doubled over an Incomplete Clip. Sure would like to see an edge pic of this...

 

I'm curious about the edge, too, so I sent Mike a question asking if he could provide photos of the edge, particularly at both ends of the rim. If he sends them to me, I'll be sure to post them.

Chris

 

There are no legitimate incomplete clips known among copper-plated zinc Lincoln cents. Therefore, it would seem unlikely that this error could have started out as an incomplete clip that subsequently broke apart. On the other hand, Mike does report a well-developed cut-and-tear texture on the edge of the coin. That would be consistent with the scenario he lays out. I am non-committal about the authenticity of this specimen. I would have to examine it personally under a microscope.

 

As I mentioned, I sent Mike Ellis a request asking him to post additional photos of the edge. Here they are........

Chris

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=170499757644&ssPageName=ADME:X:RTQ:US:1123

 

I'm still undecided. The rough edge suggests exposure of broken metal crystallites and a natural break. On the other hand, I don't like the flattening or beveling of the obverse face next to the broken/sheared edge. The little bit of copper that covers the exposed zinc on the edge in the first edge photo also bugs me.

 

Mike, in this photo, it appears that the planchet might have been only partially cut out of the sheet. Notice how part is relatively smooth and part appears to have broken away. What do you think?

Chris

 

Yes, this is a "cut-and-tear" texture that would be consistent with a genuine blank or an incomplete clip that broke apart after the strike. However, use of a sharp, hollow punch outside the Mint can create the same effect. I've seen the effect duplicated on a fake off-metal error that was encapsulated by a major grading service.

 

These are the ones that bother me. Note the uneven edge. If it had been punched out of the sheet wouldn't you expect to see a smoother line along the cut?

Chris

 

Yes, those are also disturbing features.

 

Without judging the authenticity of this piece: when I was much younger, I took some garden scissors to a Lincoln cent. Took me an hour or so to get through the whole thing, but I did end up cutting it (I later learned of some potential legal issues with this...) My cent looked similar to this - except it was ever so slightly bent due to the way I cut it. It's hard to tell the exact color from the pictures, but my cent was clearly "silver"-colored (zinc-colored to be more accurate) along the cut edge.

If this is in fact a real piece, then the edge should be entirely plated the same as the rest of the coin, right? Because the planchet would have been clipped, then had the next layer applied -- right?

Dima

 

No. The metals are bonded together before the planchets are cut.

Chris

 

The planchet is plated after going through the upset mill. So a planchet that breaks apart after being struck will show exposed zinc. So will a coin that is cut in half outside the Mint. A conventional clip (curved, straight, ragged, etc) will be fully plated on the edge.