Cleaned Cents from Heaven?

Does this coin look cleaned by anyone other than me?

Ruben

http://coins.heritageauctions.com/common/view_item.php?Inventory_No=800000861#photo

 

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And what is Upright?

 

It's not cleaned, just red, like the day it was minted. And the upright 55 is referring to the 55 in the date being upright and not slanted.

 

Man "oh" man Drusus needs to give the boys at Hertiage a class on how to take a picture with that one I cant tell.

BRUCE"THE FRANK GROUP"

 

What's wrong with the picture o.o? It's only 10 times better than my pictures=/

 

I thought I had seen it before...

http://cgi.ebay.com/1855-1c-PCGS-MS...ryZ11950QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItem

 

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I'm failing to understand how a coin can be red after 150 years, not to mention that I thought I saw scrub marks around where it says ONE CENT inside the wreath.

If this is red, someone needs to put it in an airtight case.

Ruben

 

It just does not look natural to me I guess I have seen to many great pictures from our members however this is only my opinion and that wont even buy me a cup of coffee.

 

Already today Doug reminded us about a topic a few weeks ago when we talked about how even some silver coins can be blast white after many years---so can copper---and believe me---this coin is RED!....
And as far as I know there is no 100% airtight case---

Speedy

 

BTW--I don't agree with the grade--and I outlined in RED what I don't like about the coin..

The black dots that I only outlined a few of are carbon spots--while that is almost normal coins I wouldn't grade it 65 with that many---also the spots on the back look almost like the coin was corroded at one time and was "helped" by a pro....but that could be a planchet flaw....and if that is then it shouldn't hurt the grade in any way but eye appeal.
The spots in the hair and stars (that I didn't outline) show that the strike was weak....and that is why the lack of detail.
I don't know about the other guys---and I'm still learning grading and copper coin grading so I hope the other guys post with their thoughts---but I don't grade this coin higher than MS63.

Speedy

 

Helped by a pro how? those marks you outlines are what I think are cleaning marks, and even scrape marks.

How can copper in an oxegen environment be this color after 170 years? It would have to be in a virtually O2 free environment. Copper is very active.

Ruben

 

Ruben, it is possibly to restore mint red brilliance to a coin that has toned. I won't say how, but I have seen it done, and I will say that it is a dangerous process to say the least.

 

Speedy & Zane:
The marks around the words One Cent, seem to be either planchet flaws, not likely, or possible die burn.
Do you agree?

 

Frank---I've been looking and relooking these photos over---I can't decide if it is spot that was corroded or if it is a planchet flaw....
I've enlarged the photo many times the normal size and it looks like the mark around the E in ONE...it looks like it goes under the E on one side and comes out the other side---if that is the case then I would say that it would be a planchet flaw----even then I still don't grade it higher because I think it takes away from the overall look of the coin. That is what your eyes are drawn to anytime you look at the coin...

Speedy

 

Frank,
I feel that that is a planchet flaw. I also agree with speedy's assessment that the coin that it is now overgraded. I suspect it was fine when holdered, but I think the coin is going to turn in the holder.

I saw an ms-67 red indian penny in an NGC holder, that turned into a ms-63 rb ish coin. I know this has happened to all the major TPG's, which is unfortunate.

 

I dunno... I have a couple of late 1950's cents which are red as the day they were minted. That's 50 years right there. I also have some very red red/brown Indians (more red than brown but just short of the red designation). It might be rare that there are red ones from 150 years ago, but I don't think it's impossible.

 

AH HAH - See that Zane! YOU SEE Me not ALWAYS as stupid as I spill! I see cleaning cleaning! grawww

Ruben

 

Ruben,
I think you are confused. Cleaning, and dipping are not the same thing. There is a significant difference.