cac stickers can help a coin when selling

Discussion in 'US Coins Forum' started by potty dollar 1878, Feb 16, 2021.

  1. GoldFinger1969

    GoldFinger1969 Supporter! Supporter

    You can dislike the "CAC-ification" of the hobby and that's fine with me.

    But there's a HUGE world of difference between B.S. marketing garbage like "1st Strike" and "First Releases" and a CAC sticker.

    John Albanese is well-respected in the industry and on certain coins (i.e., gold Double Eagles) a CAC sticker can be tough to get.
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  3. GoldFinger1969

    GoldFinger1969 Supporter! Supporter

    Confused about what you are saying here. Are you implying someone had counterfeit CAC stickers ?
    Obone and potty dollar 1878 like this.
  4. GoldFinger1969

    GoldFinger1969 Supporter! Supporter

    Good points.....
    What's a "4PG" and what's with the "balloons" ?
    Can you give us an example of the collectibles ?
    I'll try and look for it, anybody got a link to it, please post it.
    potty dollar 1878 likes this.
  5. GoldFinger1969

    GoldFinger1969 Supporter! Supporter

    Wasn't the bigger mistake on the part of the TPG ?

    True, Albanese probably blessed a coin at MS-62 that JohnM says probably should have been no higher than AU-58. But (without knowing the coin) we all know that even PROPERLY graded coins can look better in AU-58 than low-60's MS.

    If this WAS a good-looking AU-58 -- incorrectly called an MS-62 -- then CAC probably should NOT have given it a sticker because while it may have looked "good for a 62" it SHOULD have been an AU-58.

    Not only was it numerically graded too high, but they put it in the Mint State section instead of the About Uncirculated section.

    "Sliders" can be tough for the TPGs and apparently CAC, too.
    potty dollar 1878 and YoloBagels like this.
  6. Lehigh96

    Lehigh96 Toning Enthusiast

    I'm not here to defend CAC, and I am sure they don't get everything right, but the basic premise of CAC was to fight gradeflation by separating the wheat from the chaff, and restore some value to coins that were solid for the grade instead of having all of the coins dragged down by the dreck.

    All I'm saying is that you can't complain about gradeflation watering down prices and then complain that CAC is raising prices. You have to pick which one you are against, which makes me a firm supporter of CAC even though they don't even grade my series outside of the proofs and varieties.
  7. charley

    charley Well-Known Member

    4pg is fourth party grading.
    Balloons as in the collectors that have an opinion that CAC is just another bubble that will eventually burst, meaning just another scam or sales hype.

    If you go to PCGS and use the key word search....some words/phrases suggestions would be CAC/Mark Feld/Charley, as examples..... it should be there. I know when the architecture was changed some real older stuff was lost, which was a shame because there were outstanding info threads such as Saintguru stuff.
    Th CAC stuff was ca. 2008, iirc. I think at one time Mark had archived it before his irrational removal from the boards. Quite a few of us left in sympathetic protest.
  8. Lehigh96

    Lehigh96 Toning Enthusiast

    My usage of the word "rarities" was meant more to convey a certain price level. It seems to me that often the most vocal critics of CAC collect coins at a level that would never need a CAC sticker. There is absolutely no reason to have an MS65 common date Morgan Dollar sent to CAC.

    I guess it is up to each person to draw their own monetary threshold, but I wouldn't send my coins to CAC unless they were 4 figure coins or the next grade up is a conditional rarity with a high 4 figure value.
  9. charley

    charley Well-Known Member

    No, as the 4pg, I lay that at the feet of CAC.
    I would also opine that if it was a 58 posing as a 62, gold would have been in order, and considering the market CAC built, gold is not a maybe maybe not grading question.
  10. BJBII

    BJBII Metrologist, CSSBB

    It is interesting that in each of the examples at the start of this post, where GC was one of the auction houses, GC was the highest price. So, was it the sticker or the auction house? I am just saying' this is a small sample and we should not draw too many conclusions.
    I certainly have more slabbed coins without a CAC sticker that slabs with one. When purchased, the CAC sticker is not much added value to me. But, I am buying coins I like and not for potential profit.
  11. charley

    charley Well-Known Member

    My position is the use of the word rarities. Is 1909 svdb rare? Is a 1916 D rare? Is a 1936 3 legged rare? Is a 50D rare?

    If compared to an 1836 reeded edge, no.

    The point is, rarity is not always what is popular or believed to be rare. A lot of times, the condition can make a common coin rare.

    Average hobby coins are graded by CAC. I mean, don't hurry and submit tons of modern U.S. Mint releases, but other than that, it is not necessary to have the big ticket items.

    The point? CAC certainly grades coins for the common man and which are common man value.

    BTW, before committing to posting this reply, I read your post again to make sure I was replying to the questions. I then read the reply by Lehigh96.

    I completely agree and endorse his post.
  12. baseball21

    baseball21 Well-Known Member

    It's some made up story hes told before. He may have the details confused that they may have been soliciting submissions with no assurance of a sticker, but this story that they were just selling stickers for money is complete BS
    potty dollar 1878 likes this.
  13. baseball21

    baseball21 Well-Known Member

    It is VERY well documented and very visible across a multitude of venues that CAC coins bring stronger prices than unstickered ones especially when they're PCGS
  14. potty dollar 1878

    potty dollar 1878 Well-Known Member

    I didn't known my thread would turn into a war!!!!
    Two Dogs and Beefer518 like this.
  15. baseball21

    baseball21 Well-Known Member

    Anything CAC and there's people out there that get angry. It's the numismatic equivalent of asking people who they voted for
  16. charley

    charley Well-Known Member

    Why would you think that? I think it has been a great discussion.

    Give yourself some credit for an interesting thread.
  17. potty dollar 1878

    potty dollar 1878 Well-Known Member

    Thanks it just seems like there's been some bad back to back talk
  18. Phil's Coins

    Phil's Coins Well-Known Member

    NO, when they first started, they had people going from show to show with a roll of stickers. Telling the brokers that if they put this on their slabbed coins they would increase their profit. NOTE: I did not witness this myself, it was told to me by Mr. Charles Hayes of Hayes Coins in Springfield, MO. Charles was very well known in and around MO. One of the truly "Honest" dealers. Charles passed away in mid2020 but I have NO DOUBT what he relayed to me was witnessed. I also have a friend that collects and goes to the shows and he relayed a very similar story to me.
    Stay Safe
    potty dollar 1878 likes this.
  19. Phil's Coins

    Phil's Coins Well-Known Member

    There is no confusion. I stated that I was NOT THERE but knowing the man as I did, I have NO doubt that someone was going from booth to booth with a roll of stickers. I have also heard this from another individual that to my knowledge had no association with C. Hayes.
    The ONLY thing CAC does is take a coin already graded by someone else and gives it their blessing.
    potty dollar 1878 likes this.
  20. baseball21

    baseball21 Well-Known Member

    And people wonder how internet rumors start


    Your implication that CAC was SELLING stickers is complete BS
  21. Phil's Coins

    Phil's Coins Well-Known Member

    Not trying to start a verbal war. You can believe what you want. I believe Charles, I cannot say NOR CAN YOU.
    stay safe.
    potty dollar 1878 likes this.
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