Authentic Atocha Reale 8?

Good afternoon and Happy Fourth of July to all!

We came across a customer who is asking about the authenticity of an 'Atocha Reale 8' coin; I'm hoping someone has experience working with these type of coins?

Any information is helpful!

 

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In class, we learned that in many cases much of Authentication is done using powers of magnification much higher than you have posted. It will take an unusual expert on these coins to comment.

 

There is no real good way to authenticate any shipwreck coin unless there is proper paperwork. Atocha was found July 1985 and has been salvaged since then and still is today because the aftercastle(Captains Quarters) of the ship is still missing and it would of held the valuable emeralds and most of the gold. If your customer is really wanting to get the authenticity of the 8 Reales I recommend contacting 'Mel Fisher's Treasure' which is the company that is owned and operated by Mel's sons because if it is a real 8 Reales from the Atocha they are the only legal company to authenticate it because on 1 July 1992 the U.S. Supreme Court ruled that Mel Fisher is owner of all treasure found at the wreck because State of Florida claimed the wreck when they found it and was forcing Mel Fisher in giving 20% of what they found to the State of Florida.

 

There are several TPGS's that authenticate cobs. I have heard that the Fisher's can tell if a coin came from their wreck and I have seen sea salvage with "Atocha" paperwork.

I have also heard claims made decades ago that the genuine treasure was "salted" with counterfeits. Perhaps that is why the Fisher documents are necessary. A TPGS will not put a specific "wreck designation" on the label without paperwork.

 

Hard to tell without paperwork as said above. Definitely looks like a genuine 8 reale.

 

Mind posting more close up pictures of the 8 Reales?

 

Only possible way to attribute that piece to the Atocha wreck would be to contact the Mel Fisher Maritime Museum and hope they can help. I know some of the stuff was made into jewelry and given to family and friends involved in the discovery so it's possible someone involved will recognize it.

http://www.melfisher.org/

 

One Jeweler I was using ...the key word is "was" he mount my cobs, but before he did he make a cast of them...he did several of mine from my 1715 fleet collection. After I found out he no longer got my business.

 

100% agreement. Not sea salvage!

 

You got to understand they sit under ten feet of sand which shifts, some coins in shipwrecks get sandblasted and end up breaking. You can go on Mel Fishers website which they sell some of the coins and see that some are exactly like this coin. Yes his coin is in bad shape but it's exactly what Atocha coins with Grade 3 look like.
example of a better looking one of his. Not all shipwreck coins are pretty nor can be cleaned and they have to sell them some how. Better pictures would help to see if a mint mark and date is still present on the coin.

 

Based on the size relative to the loop, I'd say it's more likely to be a 1 real than an 8. Weight would help. Generally the gold is 14k on these and a real world value is $125-150.

 

Thinking the same thing due to the cross.

 

Beach wrecks often are sanded smooth , I have a 8 reales from the Johanna went aground in Cape Town SA. Smooth as butter.

 

BlackBeard_Thatch, posted: "You got to understand they sit under ten feet of sand which shifts, some coins in shipwrecks get sandblasted and end up breaking. You can go on Mel Fishers website which they sell some of the coins and see that some are exactly like this coin."

Thanks for the image! The coin below is what some salvage coins look like. I've seen worse.



What you need to understand Captain Thatch is the closest the OP's coin got to salt water is if someone spit on it.

Of course they sell coins just like the OP's in the Treasure Museum. See if you can figure out how they do it.

HO, HO, HO, I'll never tell...

 

I think it would also be helpful to ask the customer, why they think it is from the Atocha. Also, jewelers clean their jewelry so if they saw the coin as jewelry then they might have cleaned it too. Look for surface hairlines.

 

My 2001ish Atocha purchases (directly from Mel Fisher's gallery) all came with their certificate of authenticity and other paperwork.

I've looked at selling them on eBay but the sold prices there were disappointing.

When I visited their gallery over 15 years ago they showed chunks of silver coins all stuck together in a tank of water; gold coins, bars, etc I know nothing about preservation and what happens in the environment over hundreds of years. But it's pretty neat to see everything and own some of the history.

 

At Coins Since 1994, we appreciate all of the helpful information you all have provided. We have shared this thread with our customer. I hope you all enjoyed blowing stuff up last night (4th of July).