An unusually nice S805 Heraclius

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by nerosmyfavorite68, Apr 13, 2022.

  1. nerosmyfavorite68

    nerosmyfavorite68 Well-Known Member

    The Heraclius S805 issue is one of the most common in the Byzantine series; I ordered many of them when Allen Berman had his 4/20 junkbox deal. However, I find the series to be quite enjoyable. Finding a really nice one (although AB's 'junk box' ones were better than 70% of the ones on vcoins) is really difficult. Finding one with facial features and/or a decent bit of legend is very tough. One with a beard; unheard of! If the coin were cleaned a little more, there would be more details. I know my limitations, so I don't want to risk damaging it, so it will stay semi-cleaned for a while. The A.B. junk box ones would actually kind of look like this; except a bit more worn.

    I had set out to get some really nice examples of certain Byzantine Sear numbers. This was the nicest one on ebay, and only 50-something Euros. There's one on ma coins with sharp details and almost complete legends, but ugly, corroded surfaces and at 5 times the price.

    This was from Biga. It took quite a while, almost a month, but I think that was due to the post and not them. I'll just know to wait a while next time. No biggie.

    Oh, I need some fresh flips. Where do I get them? Some European dealers either put the coins in baggies or paper envelopes. The NeroNumi Nero needs a flip.

    I have a little basket full of numismatic odds and ends; flip inserts, flips I swap out, etc. I thought I had exhausted the emergency flips flips (Biga puts them in baggies), but out of the basket comes a Claudius Gothicus in a saflip! I wonder where that came from? I have no recollection of buying it. Out goes claudius into the baggie and in goes Justinian.

    Dealer description:
    HERACLIUS with HERACLIUS CONSTANTINE.(610-641).Constantinople.Follis.

    Obv : Heraclius, bearded, on left, and Heraclius Constantine, on right, standing facing, both crowned and cuirassed, both holding cross on globe, cross between their heads.

    Rev : Large M, ANNO to left, cross above, year IIII and later to right, Γ officina letter below; mintmark CON.
    Sear 805.

    Do you think it's year III or Year IIII? My hands are wet and I don't want to handle the coin.

    Weight : 13.6 gr
    Diameter : 30 mm

    I had thrown in an inexpensive ($38) Justinian follis as a filler. I love the BIG coins! Not bad at all for the price! It's a bit nicer and less dry-looking than the photo.


    JUSTINIAN I.(527-565).Nicomedia.Follis.

    Helmeted, cuirassed bust facing, holding cross on globe and shield with horseman motif, cross to right.

    Rev : Large M, ANNO to left, cross above, regnal year to right, B officina letter below, mintmark NIKO.

    Sear 201.

    weight : 20.1 gr
    Diameter : 36 mm
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  3. Quant.Geek

    Quant.Geek Well-Known Member

    Year III is my bet. Here is mine for the same regal year that I bought on ebay four years ago. Of course, finding a coin like this will be challenging now due to the demand for Byzantine coins:

    Byzantine Empire: Heraclius (610-641) Æ Follis, Constantinople, RY 3 (Sear 805; DOC 76b)
    Obv: ddNNhЄRACLI ЧSЄT hЄRACONSTPAV; Heraclius, on left, and Heraclius Constantine, on right, standing facing, each holding globus cruciger; cross above
    Rev: Large M; Christogram above, A/N/N/O II/I across field; B below; CON in exergue


    and your Justinian coin:

    Byzantine Empire: Justinian I (527-565) Æ Follis, Nicomedia, RY 22 (Sear 201; DOC 135b; MIBE 113a)
    Obv: D N IVSTINI-ANVS P P AVG; Helmeted and cuirassed bust facing, holding globus cruciger and shield; cross to right
    Rev: Large M, above, cross; to left A/N/N/O; to right X/X/II;below B; NIKO in exergue


    There is still a massive collection of Byzantine coins that I need to photograph once things eases down a bit (old lots I purchased and other one off coins)...
    Last edited: Apr 14, 2022
  4. nerosmyfavorite68

    nerosmyfavorite68 Well-Known Member

    Thanks, and you have a great Byzantine collection!

    Oh, the demand for Byzantine is up again? I only recently got back into Byzantine, partly due to the podcast The History of Byzantium.
    Quant.Geek likes this.
  5. Quant.Geek

    Quant.Geek Well-Known Member

    The prices have been crazy lately, but that is also true across the board. There seems to be more Byzantine collectors than there were a year or two ago...
    robinjojo and sand like this.
  6. nerosmyfavorite68

    nerosmyfavorite68 Well-Known Member

    How quickly do you think the massive Justinian folles were driven out of circulation? Did the pre-reform issues circulate at a lower tariff?
    sand likes this.
  7. robinjojo

    robinjojo Well-Known Member

    Interesting coins!

    Here's a follis of Heraclius, Sear 804, year 3, Constantinople, officina B, which has his portrait on the reverse. The coin was double struck (clear rotation), plus it was over struck on a follis that is likely one from Phocas.

    This coin came out of an auction group lot of Byzantine bronzes in 2020.

    D-Camera Phocas Follis, double struck, Roma,, 6-24-20.jpg
    Last edited: Apr 14, 2022
  8. robinjojo

    robinjojo Well-Known Member

    I'm in the same boat. I have lots of Byzantine coins that need attributions and labels, to say nothing of photographs.

    Those are really nice folles!
    Quant.Geek likes this.
  9. ancient coin hunter

    ancient coin hunter 3rd Century Usurper

  10. Quant.Geek

    Quant.Geek Well-Known Member

    I like your Sear 804. The overstrike adds some real class to that coin!

    Most of my photographing equipment (copy stand, etc.) is now in storage in another state due to my recent move. So, I can't even photograph things properly aside from using my cellphone or a scanner. I might just bite the bullet and get a tripod for my digital camera and use that in the meantime. There are tons of manuscripts that needs to be digitized as well and most of them are bigger than 14 inches, so they can't fit in the scanner...
    robinjojo likes this.
  11. nerosmyfavorite68

    nerosmyfavorite68 Well-Known Member

    For those who like a lot of overstrikes:

    Quant Geek's Justinian is lovely.

    I'd like to find a really nice 804. I think I did pretty well on the 805. Check out Sear's 805.

    I'm trawling vcoins, figuring out what to order. I was on the verge of ordering from Ibarra, but paypal doesn't seem to be option. I thought all the vcoins dealers took paypal?

    Oh well, I bounced back to a coin with a nice patina and I ended up adding an unusually large and heavy Caracalla with a nice patina!
    Quant.Geek likes this.
  12. David@PCC


    My most prized from this series
    Mint: Constantinople
    Year 29, 638/639 AD
    AE Follis
    Obvs: No legend. Heraclius on left and Heraclius Constantine on right standing and facing. Heraclius wears crown and military dress, holds long cross, and has moustache and long beard. His son with short beard wears crown and chalamys and holds globus cruciger.
    Revs: Large M, Θ above and B below. ANNO to left, XX IϚ II right(year 29). CON in ex.
    23x25mm, 4.7g
    Ref: DOC -, SB -, Grierson -
    Note: Even though type is listed as Sear 810, year 29 is not published. I recieved confirmation from David Sear that this coin is indeed yr 29 and that IϚ is a transposed 7.
  13. Valentinian

    Valentinian Supporter! Supporter

    Here is a Sear 805, Heraclius, clearly overstruck on a coin of Phocas (Focas):

    30 mm. 10.93 grams.
    With this orientation the year 6 (615/6) can be seen to the right of the weak M with officina Є and mintmark CON.
    To the left of the two standing figures dNhЄP beginning Heraclius's name can barely be made out.

    The undertype is Sear 640 of Phocas. The + at 9:30 in the photo is the top of the Phocas coin and just before it the "AS" of "FOCAS" is clear. The undertype is almost a clear as the overtype on the reverse--it is the common XXXX of Phocas, with ANNO above and the year (II/II) to the right.

    Byzantine overstrikes are lots of fun to decipher!
  14. Black Friar

    Black Friar Well-Known Member

    Yup, Heraclian's are always a challenge. Here a a couple I can quickly grab for this post.

    Attached Files:

  15. Hrefn

    Hrefn Well-Known Member

    Years ago the following joke was told.

    Collector: I was wondering about something. How many people do you think collect Byzantine coins, anyway?

    Dealer: Including you?
  16. Black Friar

    Black Friar Well-Known Member

    Sounds familiar. That's why as small group of us formed a "club" founded the ADBC at the ANA show in Portland, Or. in 1998. It is now active to about 5 club members. However, we still hold a meeting at NYIC and ANA shows of which I haven't been able to attend lately. For the sake of anonymity I won't mention any names including mine. Email has kept a few of us in contact and sharing new acquisitions and observations.

    Byz numismatics is a small world. The scholarly publications and research is very active and robust.
    I have been fortunate to make not only contact but friends in England, Germany, and US to keep me going.

    I look forward to all new posts and will try to make more myself. Cheers to all.
    sand and Hrefn like this.
  17. nerosmyfavorite68

    nerosmyfavorite68 Well-Known Member

    It's surprising there aren't more hardly circulated S805s, given the turbulence of the era.
  18. Quant.Geek

    Quant.Geek Well-Known Member

    I am certain there are more, its just that the market is currently being flooded with mid to low-tier coins by the auction houses we all come to love at very affordable prices. It seems a new auction house with these types of coins are popping up frequently on biddr...
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