a lot of gold, unslabbed coins

Hi folks,
I know buying gold not slabbed, especially from Ebay, is not recomended practice, however the treasure hunter in me, says nay!

This seller on Ebay, not me or anyone I know, has a lot of gold coins not slabbed for sale, feedback suggests happy customers. This person is not located in China, nor is the condition of the coins so impeccable that it leads me to believe they were just made.

In this particular auction, does the coin appear authentic with their notorious bad images?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=220468939577

Any experts have opinions to sway me in a time where my must purchase something at auction mode is in overdrive?

 

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It appears to be authentic. But it is difficult to tell if the coin has been cleaned or polished from those photos.

 

Man, I don't know. Loose anything is getting to be a gamble in ebay auctions. I don't know if it's worth risking it. I wouldn't even buy a common loose Morgan dollar off Ebay anymore. Too much Chinese garbage out there these days.
My question is where is he getting this stuff? Is he a dealer? I don't care for 'one line' auction descriptions either. That never gives me much confidence.

Just realize by now, if any coin can realize a significant value increase by submitting it to a TPG for $15, it's likely already been done. The decent, real, untampered with coins that are left, are mixed in with all the fakes and everything else that has something to hide. Are those pics quality enough for you to know what you are getting? I would say no.

Are all the people leaving feedback qualified enough to know what they actually got or know whether or not they got a fake? I would say no. So how valuable is the feedback?

There's guys selling fakes from China who have great feedback. Only once in a while an actual 'halfway' educated person receives their product, know's what they got is fake and leaves a negative. We've seen people who got ripped off STILL leave a positive and say thanks anyway. lol

When it comes to coins, I have very little faith in Ebay's feedback system. Most people don't take the time to read anything and are highly uneducated. All they know is they received a product and think they know it's high quality and real. Oh yeah, and don't tell them any different!!

 

That looks like a good $475 coin there.

 

Would you bet $100 that it was real vs. someone who thought it was fake? I mean how can you assume so easily and throw an opinion out like that based on two, dark pictures?

Also notice, "No returns accepted." Why? If the customer was happy that should never be an issue anyway.

I would stay away. It looks like nothing but trouble to me, one way or another.

 

Skip it - no returns automatically means stay away.

 

It's probably okay for a bullion price. That said, I would never bid on an unslabbed gold coin on Ebay because probably isn't good enough.

 

Did I forget to mention, I learned about this auction through craigs list in my area. This person is a nice 4o minute drive from me.. I suppose I could hunt them down if I had to

 

I agree with vess, no return policy is a huge waving red flag.

 

This is not a heavily counterfeited date and I would probably bet the $100 on originality.

I agree though that without a return policy anyone should stay away.

 

According to Bill Fivaz counterfeit gold detection guide to gold and what I have learned,

If the coin is EF grade or lower (such as this one), chances are in your favor it is a geniune coin. This is not a 100% rule however, but is a good rule of thumb.

As others have said, the no return policy means stay away. If it's counterfeit or it turns out to be, he should offer to refund you, but that doesn't seem to be the case since there's no return policy.

You never know with these coins, its a gamble, it may have been cleaned, whizzed, tooled, plugged, you just never know, especially from bad photo's. Why not buy an EF certified one instead? Go with ANACS, PCGS or NGC.

If it is counterfeit and you end up buying it, it would be a good lesson to learn from. I wish I had some reference counterfeit gold I could study, but I don't.

 

Maybe so, but post 1840 gold was very heavily counterfeited in every date. Pre-1840 gold (classic head) and early gold there are not many counterfeits for some reason.

 

But also, from the same book, he says if one's going to be counterfeited, more than likely it will be a Philadelphia coin with no mint mark so as to have one less feature that can be screwed up. Again, not a 100% rule but another risk.

I compared it to other coins on Heritage. FWIW, it does have many characteristics of a real one. If it is fake, it's an extremely good one.

If the guy is only a 40 min. drive away, it might be worth it to go over there and look at it if he'll let you. It might be a great deal. But if I were going to take the time, I'd bring my caliper and digital scale and take some measurements, along with a good quality loop. Look closely at the reeded edge. Not all, but many counterfeits get screwed up on the reeded edge. Look for fat, rounded reeds or irregular sizes. Look closely for small spikes and tool marks in the fields. If it looks cleaned, I wouldn't bid a lot for it.

 

Interesting, I guess I don't remember reading that in there (The mintmark)
If the coin is a high grade counterfeit most likely it is of the right fineness( they melt down a geniune coin sometimes for the planchet ) , weight, diameter etc falls within US mint specs..however it won't hurt to try anyway. Good stuff on the spikes and the edge, too many people over look the 'third' side of the coin.

 

If you blow up the reverse picture it looks like In god we trust is really weak for whatever reason. I would pass on the coin for that reason.

 

1721 Charles VI. Large Silver Thaler. Hall Mint. VF-XF!Wonderful, rare, broad and heavy coin. 44mm / 28.1gm
This one sold on ebay for $430.00 and as you can see the size and weight are off some so I say it could be fake. I myself got burned once with a Germany Hamburg 5 mark it weighed 22.50 grams and should have weighed 27.77 grams. Nice looking coin but still fake. So I would ask the seller that if you buy it and send it in for grading and it comes back fake or unable to grade will he refund your money even though it may take awhile to get it graded and see what he will say to that, if not I would stay away from it.
Bob​

 

No returns- don't bid.

No returns- don't bid.

Have you ever taken the ANA course on counterfeit detection or read a counterfeit detection book? An individual with this knowledge would never purchase raw gold without a return policy.

Respectfully submitted,
collect89

 

If you want to test this seller, buy one coin and send it in for grading to one of the grading services. ANACS does that with no "club" fee. Then you can see if its authentic or has any problems.

But I wouldn't bid on any auction with a "no return" policy.

Good luck.

 

Its risky. No returns accepted is suspicious, almost all coin auctions have at least a 3day money back. I would say its not worth it. At least buy something with a return policy so you can have it checked out by a dealer. GOod luck!

 

As noted no returns means someone knows something and you don't.
As to buying anything valuable on ebay or anywhere over the internet, it's always taking a chance. If a price was really low, might be worth taking a chance but then too the lower the price, the more there could be something wrong. A kid I know showed me a $5 Gold piece he purchased on ebay for $5. Even odder was the seller paid the postage. It turned out to be real too. You never know.