I am an amateur when it comes to German thalers and wonder if anyone would help in helping me with some information about this coin? It's an 1769 thaler silver coin from Bavaria 41mm diameter and 28 grams - Does it look authentic? - What does the inscriptions mean? I have seen other ones on EBay with the same motives but the inscriptions differ. Mint marks or? Would also appreciate any suggestion on good online resources for German thalers [emoji4] Thanks! Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Not an expert, but it looks authentic. Heavily cleaned and may have had a jewelry mount or hole repaired at the top, but it's hard to tell from the Photo. The green may be green slime, from being in a PVC flip. The residue is acidic and can ruin your coin. I don't have any references handy, but Krause's German Coins and Their Values will have it. I recall these being available in a number of diff dates. About 10 years ago, I think the going rate for a coin like this was in the $20 range
Here is a quick shot of the Krause page, 2011 edition. I can't tell you about the inscriptions, I think John Davenport's books would have them. (Dav.#1954 according to this.) And I am sure there are other resources. Neat old coin, but with the cleaning I suspect the value would be no more than $30. The scratches on the back are probably mint made adjustment marks, filed to adjust the coin's weight.
Heavily polished and ex-jewelry, so it will be worth less than the Krause values @longshot posted. That being said, it's not a totally displeasing piece, and the retoning gives enough darker contrast around the lettering and devices to make the design stand out nicely. As mentioned, the crisscross scratches are likely mint adjustment marks done with a file to the blank flan, prior to striking, for weight adjustment purposes. The obverse abbreviations D.G.MAX.IOS.U.B.D.S.R.I.A.&EL.L.L. equate to Dei Gratia [by the grace of (God)] Maximilian Joseph, Duke of both Bavarias, Archdapifer and Elector of S.R.I., Landgrave of Leuchtenberg. I'm not sure what the "S.R.I." was. I looked up "archdapifer" and found a rather interesting definition from the 1828 Webster's dictionary: webstersdictionary1828.com That's a funny one! Suffice it to say, ol' Maximilian Joseph had an awful lot of titles, but that's the first time I can recall seeing reference to someone being a "horseback-riding meat carrier" on a coin! (Nowadays the emperor would probably just call Domino's Pizza or its German equivalent, right?) The "A" mintmark would, in this case, be for Amberg, though usually an "A" mintmark on a German coin indicates Berlin.
Agreed about Amberg. Keep in mind that in those days there was no "Germany" in the sense of a country. When Prussia introduced mintmarks, Berlin did indeed get the A (in 1750), but that system did not apply outside the country. So Bavaria had a different system ... SRI refers to the Holy Roman Empire (Sacrum Romanum Imperium), and Maximilian III Joseph was indeed an elector (Kurfürst, i.e. one of those who elected the emperor). He was "Pfalzgraf bei Rhein", and along with that came the office of being the "Erztruchsess". I would have used maiordomus or maybe steward as the English translation; anyway, other electors had other "arch-" titles. The Elector of Saxony for example was Erzmarschall (Arch-Marshal), and so on. Christian
Thanks all for great and very interesting inputs! I think this coin would be nice to have, also since I don't have any thalers from before. But this went for $50 and I hopped off the auction before that. Have also seen other more pleasing examples of the Maximilian III thalers for the same price and also seen other ones in the same series, might have been the 1753, for up to $500. Anyways, these coins have a great legacy with both a history from the beginning of the large silver coins of Europe (1500s) to the other large silver coins produced later on in in UK, Spain, USA and so on... Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Back in the early ebay days, I picked up 3 diff dates at various times. 1 has a mount removed and the others are cleaned. Still, they are nice looking coins, and I really like them. $50 may be too high for this coin, but I would do some searches to see what the going rate is.
