1753 Columnario Lima mint

Discussion in 'World Coins' started by Robinson Crusoe, Oct 31, 2006.

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  1. Robinson Crusoe

    Robinson Crusoe New Member

    Hello
    I have recently purchased a Lima Columnario, 1753, which has a floral edge running round the edge, this pattern is supposed to run in opposite directions prior to 1762, this one has the floral pattern running the same direction all the way round. Is this normal on Lima minted coins ?
     
    Robinson Crusoe, Oct 31, 2006
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  3. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    Howdy Robinson - Welcome to the Forum !!

    The rules were different for most of the mints. For example Mexico City and Guatemala were the only mints to produce pillar dollars where the laurel leaves on the edges pointed in different directions. But at the Lima mint, from 1752 onwards, all of the leaves pointed in one direction. But there are two clear joints visible.

    Post a pic of your coin you can, even if your coin does have the correct leaf pattern - that doesn't mean it is genuine. I also suggest weighing the coin.
     
    GDJMSP, Oct 31, 2006
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  4. Bonedigger

    Bonedigger New Member

    That's not a good sign... Can you post a picture?

    Ben
     
    Bonedigger, Oct 31, 2006
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  5. Robinson Crusoe

    Robinson Crusoe New Member

    1753 Columnario

    Hello
    Here are the attached scans, I'll try to get an image of the edge.
     

    Attached Files:

    Robinson Crusoe, Oct 31, 2006
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  6. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    Other than a couple of raised marks on the surfaces I see nothing to make me suspect the coin is not authentic. However, such marks can be a sign of a counterfeit. I suggets you weigh the coin and report back. You can do so at a jewelry store, I need to know the weight to with 1 one hundredth of a gram - for example 26.89 grams - or whatever it is.
     
    GDJMSP, Oct 31, 2006
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  7. Robinson Crusoe

    Robinson Crusoe New Member

    floral edge

    I have attched a couple of shots showing the edge, it is worn a bit on the other side so this is the best impression. The weight is 26 point something grams, I'll need to check that again ( don't have a jewellers scales here)
     

    Attached Files:

    Robinson Crusoe, Oct 31, 2006
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  8. Aidan Work

    Aidan Work New Member

    It looks genuine to me,but weighing it can also confirm whether it is,or if it is a dud.

    Aidan.
     
    Aidan Work, Nov 1, 2006
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  9. satootoko

    satootoko Retired

    A significantly off-weight coin is a confirmed fake, but correct weight is only one factor in confirming a genuine piece.
     
    satootoko, Nov 1, 2006
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  10. gxseries

    gxseries Coin Collector

    Am I the only one who notice the number "5" seems to be inversed?
     
    gxseries, Nov 1, 2006
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  11. sumorada

    sumorada Senior Member

    did anyone notice that the " 5 " is upside down?:eek:
     
    sumorada, Nov 1, 2006
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  12. Bonedigger

    Bonedigger New Member

    That's the way the (5) is struck on these.

    Ben
     
    Bonedigger, Nov 1, 2006
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  13. sumorada

    sumorada Senior Member

    i knew that was the case with the 4 reales, but the 8 reales are right side up! KM# 55.1
     

    Attached Files:

    sumorada, Nov 1, 2006
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  14. Bonedigger

    Bonedigger New Member

    Attached Files:

    Bonedigger, Nov 1, 2006
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  15. Bonedigger

    Bonedigger New Member

    Bonedigger, Nov 1, 2006
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  16. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    The 5 is correct for that date from the Lima mint. Here is what bothers me about the coin.

    See the raised marks I have circled - they aren't supposed to be there. And such raised marks are one of the characteristics of counterfeits.
     

    Attached Files:

    GDJMSP, Nov 1, 2006
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  17. Robinson Crusoe

    Robinson Crusoe New Member

    Re the raised marks, I have an 1805 portrait 8 Reales with similar marks which is authentic and was told it can be caused by particles which have fallen on the dies during manufacture. Does this sound likely??
     
    Robinson Crusoe, Nov 3, 2006
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  18. Robinson Crusoe

    Robinson Crusoe New Member

    Re the weight, it appears to be 26.2 grams
     
    Robinson Crusoe, Nov 3, 2006
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  19. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    Maximum permissable weight was 27.2638 grams - minimum permissable weight was 26.8646 grams. I have to say it sounds like the coin is a counterfeit.


    As for the raised marks being caused by particles that fall on the die during manufacture - not likely. The dies were all carved by hand and by using small punches on the flat surface of the die blanks. They didn't apply any pressure to the fields that would cause particles of anything to create a depression in the face of the die.
     
    GDJMSP, Nov 3, 2006
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  20. Robinson Crusoe

    Robinson Crusoe New Member

    Raised marks

    Hello
    I have an 1805 8 Reales with raised marks on the surface, I was told these occurred sometimes when particles fell on the surface of the dies during manufacture, is this likely ??

    The Lima coin has a patina, it has the right'ring' when spun on a table, it has moderate wear , it appears to weigh 26.2 grams, to my limited knowledge it appears genuine . The Chinese fakes all seem to have a certain look to them , and also don't seem to exhibit any wear which would be expected after 200 years.
     
    Robinson Crusoe, Nov 3, 2006
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  21. Robinson Crusoe

    Robinson Crusoe New Member

    floral edge

    Does anyone have any images showing what the overlap should look like on the floral edging ?
     
    Robinson Crusoe, Nov 3, 2006
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