Is this a good price for this coin?

Minus overheads and tax...

 

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Two points I see to this thread, learn about the coin before you spend your money and sweat and the second point was hilarious that through your investigation you found out a little more of what hands your coin passed through and how much profit was realized by your purchasing of it ( Outstanding ).

 

Coin came today. Very satisfied, even if I paid $300 more than the Hammer. It's gorgeous. Now to get it certified

Also weighs 8g.

 

Hammer at an auction does not matter, the dealer made a good buy. If not 2325 from you, he would have got it from someone else.

Gorgeous coin, congrats.

 

So is this the modern way to collect coins? Buy sight unseen without doing any research and then ask for random opinions from the internet?

 

The OP saw the coin in person at the ANA and negotiated the price there. He was just asking opinions here.

I agree its better to know about the coinage first, but I think he did ok.

 

Right, medoraman. silvermonger, you made a very uninformed statement to me. I didn't buy it sight unseen. I saw it in hand at the ANA show. that wasn't real nice to just make that sarcastic statement when you didn't know all the history behind the transaction.

 

i'll post pictures of the coin tomorrow night.

 

Update on the coin:

David Vagey of NGC Ancients graded it AU.

On its way back to me now.

Woohoo! Way higher than I expected!

 

I understand your happiness, but every time I hear of an ancient graded AU I die little. At least its not "MS63 weak strike worn die PQ ++++ CAC" Your coin was a nice gVf to XF coin, really nice. I do not know what an AU ancient is.

I just cannot believe David Vagi doing this to our hobby. I used to be a customer of his. I hope he doesn't think he can return to being a dealer.

 

nice

 

why do you have to hate?

i disagree. i think the coin is an XF. i was shocked to get an AU grade but i had a small intuition that thought it may pass as one.

the detail on the obverse, the centering & flan all are contributing factors. the reverse is the biggest concern as it's weaker in detail, but there is still some possible luster on the coin and I think AU is a deserving grade for this gold stater. Hey, we also found out that Vagi thinks it's authentic! A+!

 

That's an awfully venomous attack. While I don't like it much, and would never have my coins slabbed, the program isn't all bad. Have you ever spoken to Vagi in person about it?

 

post some pics when you get it back

 

Don't like the coin much you are referring to? Or don't like getting coins slabbed? If you don't like the coin much, why? I've seen a lot of these staters and I rarely see them with such centering.

To randygeki, I most certainly will post pics when it comes back!

 

Not meaning to speak for him, but I think its the program/slabs

 

I thought the coin was a wonderful coin. An XF ancient is a superlative coin in most every sense. I am truly sorry the OP thought I was hating on either him or his coin. If you tell an ancient collector a coin is XF then you are saying it is about as good of quality as can be acquired. The only grade higher is FDC, which is extremely rare.

No, I have not talked to David Vagi about him joining NGC. I haven't seen him in a couple of years. My problem with slabbing is multi, starting with them imposing a grading system that most ancient collectors do not follow, do not grade by, and imposing grades we do not use. If they wanted to slab ancients, then they should follow what that group of collectors use. To impose American grading systems on collectors who have been colelcting long before the US was even a country is the height of arrogance. How would US colelctors feel if a European firm started slabbing US coins using a 1-100 grading system with different names for grades? Wouldn't US collectors get mad and insulted that a foreign firm is using the wrong grading system on their coins?

P.S. As an aside, a XF ancient would probably translate somewhere between 45-62 on the US grading scale. This disagreement right here is an example of the confusion US TPG'ers have already introduced into the ancient market.

 

Sorry if you thought it was too strong Ardatirion. I respect your posts a lot here and will try to dial it back or just not comment. I would actually not mind the program now since I know David is a good dealer and knows coins, I just wish they would use our grading system and grades. If they wanted to put a number beside it whatever. It could be helpful for some new people to reassure them, but to not use our grading system I think is pure arrogance and dismissive of hundreds of years of collecting tradition. It is an attack on ancient collecting and trying to impose their system of grading arbitrarily. For that, David Vagi and TPG'ers have earned my scorn. I can see in my mind all of the US collectors looking at pricing guides and thinking an XF slab is worht what a price guide for ancients has for a XF. They are NOT the same grade, and the slabs will be creating mass confusion everywhere.

How is trashing our grading scale deliberately not an attack on ancient numismatics? It will take our market 20 years to deal with this mass confusion on grades slabs will introduce.

 

thanks for your well placed argument, medoraman. i was curious however, why does Harlan Berk and others advertise some of their Ancients as Mint State?

Are they adhering to U.S Grading standards instead of the ones you mention?

Are you saying XF is the best grade for Ancients aside from the few that come back FDC(What does that stand for)

 

FDC if Fleur de Coin, a french term for a high end BU example. Berk advertising Mint State is his way of saying FDC. FDC is usually better than just mint state, since we all know mint state can just be MS60, a really crappy coin with technically no wear. His mint state coins I would equate to FDC, as they are really nice, (but out of my bidget of course).

I know its different terminology than US, but that is the point. This is what we and ancient collectors around the world know. Not all ancient collectors know how to convert grades back and forth, especially non US ancient collectors. That is the huge concern I have about using US grades on ancients.

And yes, XF is the best grade an ancient can be except for a tiny amount of truly exceptional pieces. That is why when I said yours was gVF to XF I really was complimenting it as a excellent piece. Maybe I should have just said XF, but I tend to be a strict grader and the little softness made me fudge. Using US grading scale, I am not surprised in the least of the grade they assigned it.