When it comes to details coins, what do you think is better-cleaned or artificial toning? And what is your reasoning? The subject coin is this Morgan that I didn't see evidence of cleaning on. Well neither did NGC; instead they disliked the color. Let's discuss in general and in regards to the coin posted below.
AT. AT is more subjective, you could technically just take the toning off if you wanted and some/many people would still like the look either way. AT is the least egregious of details grades
AT is better. You can dip and remove the toning but no matter what you do to a coin that’s been cleaned, it will always be cleaned.
AT is better, as it is a judgement call. Some graders get it wrong on a regular basis. Cleaning is pretty clear cut—it is damage to the surface of the coin, due to abusive and intrusive cleaning methods.
Oof….. That’s a tough one. Damage is damage and it’s rather akin to asking if a dented quarter panel is better than a dented bumper…… Speaking from an entirely personal perspective, I would have to favor a cleaned coin. I been collecting a mighty long time and blast white has always been my cup-o-tea. These neon looking coins I have seen in recent years look more like they belong on a poster I would have had on my wall in 1975. Not a fan of them.
Gotta go with the idea that AT is far and away the least problematic. Artificial toning can be easily and safely be dipped away in 1 second by anybody with working a knowledge of how to do it. And that coin can then be re-submitted and get a clean grade. (Assuming of course there are no other problems that were being covered up/hidden by the AT.)
AT is damage. The issue is: what level of damage... what AT method was/is used. To state that AT can be easily and and safely dipped away, is a bit to confident, for me.
This is a toss up as depending on the degree of cleaning or toning. I buy a lot of seated coins most have been cleaned or toned. That said i'll play the devil advocate and say both. Unless I know for a fact and can purchase for next to nothing...altered surfaces ,tooling ,whizzing i avoid. Scratched, damage depending on the degree I have no issues. The toss up between Cleaned and AT as others have said are about equal... the last coin I purchased was holed 1861 silver 3 cent pc. Every bit an XF + proof coin . A coin as such in either xf or xf proof ...not damaged would of been a very pricy specimen. For $30 I'm Very happy.
I will agree with Charley on his post... not knowing what is on the surface and will cross contamination do more damage....is a very legitimate question. So that said each specimen would be judged on an individual case...as to what is and isn't known. At least a cleaned coin can be judged as to the degree of damage and over time will the coin skin return to a more natural look.
No Brainer! AT 2 Reasons: Natural and artificial toning on a coin can always be removed. I usually advise not to because a toned coin will have more buyers interested. Those who like toned coins and those who cannot wait to dip it! The other reason is even the best numismatists in the world cannot tell the difference 100% of the time. Nature does all sorts of tings to metal. I've seen intense colors I cannot even identify in all shades of the rainbow except orange in cobweb covered buckets of silver bars and rounds that toned over time (length?) that no one could possibly believe is natural. I've also seen a top-of-his-field chemist beautifully tone several coins not to mention all the dealers who know some tricks. Remember, for a while, many "new" fraudulent toning types have be considered natural by the TPGS in the past as natural. Cleaning is different. It is or it is not and that is much easier to determine. However, as is the case for AT, in todays world, you must know when the weasels in charge of the coin market either cannot tell or choose to ignore it!
Well I recall back in the 80's working retail food... where what percentage of $ bills- notes had coke on them? I was an assistant manager who use gloves to count out the cash pans....to a $100. Bank to start . My boss ask me why...after I told him he said something to our DM and his reply smart...ask the cashiers if they like gloves also.
In my opinion, I would rather own a coin that is claimed to be AT vs Cleaned. If I felt the coin looked attractive with the artificial toning, I would enjoy it. If the coin was cleaned and I could see the wipe marks, they would bother me every time I looked at the coin. Ugly toning has a much better chance of being properly removed, than not. If the toning method had eaten away at the surface of the coin below, it should be apparent for the most part by muted luster. So the chances of recovering an AT coin to a market acceptable one are orders of magnitude higher than a cleaned one.
And if the toning is hiding cleaning/problems, and/or was AT'd for just that purpose? You would be surprised.
Is that your line of acceptance? That "look" can be and is achieved with better living thru chemistry. Hell, even olive oil. or soy oil. Or... Should carries the same weight as hope, as assurance ... zero oz./lbs.
Yes, but you are getting ahead of yourself. Coins that have hidden problems such as a cleaning via toning, are usually caught and noted as such. I don't think I have seen a coin that a TPG thought was cleaned and labeled it simply as AT or QT. We are talking slabbed coins and not raw coins. Most TPG's will catch the olive oil to improve luster. Also, I am saying what I would rather have. Not that I want or think a coin labeled as AT is what I want. You are getting a little overboard on what this thread was about. The OP was asked a very simple question. I answered why I would rather have what I would rather have, not that I WOULD want it.
Artificial toning. Excessive artificial toning can always be removed after a light dip. So called “AT coins” might straight grade if resubmitted depending on who’s grading the coin. I believe PCGS has a negative attitude towards colorfully toned Peace dollars
