Fulvia Plautilla: Live fast, die young and leave a stunning denarius

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by Ryro, Nov 2, 2021.

  1. ambr0zie

    ambr0zie Dacian Taraboste

    Great coins everyone, from an empress who is not extremely rare but you don't see her coins every day.
    I managed to buy a Plautilla recently - happy with the condition and the price (always happy to bid only once for a coin and not turning into a bidding war).
    upload_2021-11-3_1-10-48.png


    Julia Paula. Augusta AD 219-220. Rome
    Denarius AR
    17 mm, 1,93 g
    RIC IV Elagabalus 211 S; BMCRE 172 (Elagabalus); RSC 6a
    Obv: IVLIA PAVLA AVG, Bust of Julia Paula, hair waved and fastened in plait, draped, right / Rev: CONCORDIA, Concordia, draped, seated left, holding patera in extended right hand; in field, star
     
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  3. GinoLR

    GinoLR Well-Known Member

  4. GinoLR

    GinoLR Well-Known Member

    There is no serious reason to identify this much restored bust (in the Vatican Museum) as Plautianus: nobody knows what Plautianus looked like...
     
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  5. Ryro

    Ryro Trying to remove supporter status

    Lovely coin! Like my OP coin, I feel the photographer has to sacrifice the facial details to show off those stunning hairstyles, with the light coming in from the back of the head.
    A fun thing to look out for is what angle the light is coming at the coin and what the photographer is trying to highlight. Our own @dougsmit has it down to a science.
    Hehe, I wonder if this coin of Napoleon and his second wife (also a sad relationship in the end) was inspired by the reverse you and I share (my second coin):
    IMG_2604(1).PNG
    Concordia indeed.
     
  6. hotwheelsearl

    hotwheelsearl Well-Known Member

    Looks pretty close to the average appearance of the imperial coins

    edit: I misread the post as Plautilla. Idk about the attribution then
     
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2021
  7. Ryro

    Ryro Trying to remove supporter status

    Even the Vatican endorses it as, Gaius Fulvius Plautius. As well as over a dozen other sites... though, non tell of the site nor how we should believe it's him
    I do not pretended nor want anybody to believe that I am very knowledgeable when it comes to busts (trusty reader, don't snicker when it comes to that last remark. I am a father of three ;):cigar:)
    Though, I do strongly recommend anyone who does love the subject, as well as ancient coinage, should check out Mary Beard's latest, annoyingly named, "Twelve Caesars". Verrrry fun ride through how ancient and modern arts coalesce.
    Screenshot_20211102-184033.jpg
    Does anybody have any research one way or the other as to who this Brute, who looks very much like Pertinax, Didi Julian's and Caracalla had a baby, is?
     
  8. Shea19

    Shea19 Well-Known Member

    That’s a beauty, @Ryro …great coin!

    1340A8CD-7767-4CD7-AFC2-267D88738342.jpeg

    Plautilla, AR Denarius, (20mm., 3.43 g.), Draped bust of Plautilla to r. /Rev. Pietas standing r., holding sceptre and child. RIC Caracalla 367.
     
  9. ominus1

    ominus1 Well-Known Member

    ..nor i either..and really never seen any history on the child of Plautilla & caracalla .kool coins and story Ryro...i don't have her yet either (but @DonnaML has one with kid n toll ^^...kool Donna! :))
     
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  10. zumbly

    zumbly Ha'ina 'ia mai ana ka puana

    The first coin of Plautilla's I ever bought was the same type as the one @Roman Collector showed. Not the prettiest, but I still like it.

    Plautilla -- Diana Lucifera.jpg
    PLAUTILLA
    AR Denarius. 3.13g, 20.2mm. Rome mint. AD 202-205. RIC IV 366 (Scarce). O: PLAVTILLA AVGVSTA, draped bust right. R: DIANA LVCIFERA, Diana standing half left, bow on back, holding torch with both hands.
     
  11. Tejas

    Tejas Well-Known Member

    Plautilla was "in power" from 202 to January 205. Caracalla had here executed in 212. Yet, her coins show her with at least 4 different hairstyles. I think Plautilla must have been a very fashionably woman.

    I collected Plautilla by hairstyles :)

    I'm not sure, but I think that this is her first hairstyle:

    Screenshot 2021-11-03 at 07.37.47.png


    Possibly the second hairstyle:


    Screenshot 2021-11-03 at 07.44.24.png
    Yet another hairstyle, or a variation of hairstyle 2:

    Screenshot 2021-11-03 at 07.45.17.png


    And, what appears to be the most common hairstyle:

    Screenshot 2021-11-03 at 07.46.49.png
     
    Last edited: Nov 3, 2021
  12. GinoLR

    GinoLR Well-Known Member

    This bust now in Vatican was in the 18th c. in the Palazzo Nuñez Torlonia and was sold to the Vatican in 1791. The face is much mutilated : the nose, the ears, an eyebrow are modern restorations, the whole bust (cuirass, paludamentum) is modern. If it was a bust, we do not know what he was wearing (toga? peplos? cuirass? bare chest? knowing this would have helped identifying the man). Because this head is bigger than life-sized, we can reasonably suppose it was an important person with a high ranking official position. The style is clearly late 2nd - early 3rd c. But its identification with Caius Fulvius Plautianus is a mere hypothesis ! Cassius Dio wrote that there were many portraits of Plautianus, even more than portraits of Septimius Severus himself ! I don't know if such a statement must be taken at face value, but OK let's admit there were a lot of them... After his assassination by Caracalla, all of his statues and portraits were systematically destroyed, erased, cancel culture was a really serious thing at the time. The result is that not a single depiction we could surely identify with Plautianus is known today.
    This larger than life bust was first identified with Pertinax. In the 18th c. ancient busts sold better and for much more when they were portraits of famous people, like emperors for ex. It was sold to the Museum as "Pertinax". But there are many very good coins of Pertinax and art historians soon noticed this big bust did not really look like Pertinax. So, who? It could very well be a member of the imperial family : the father of Severus Alexander, or of Julia Domna, or even some high ranking official of the early Severian regime like Laetus for ex. Plautianus is a possibility, no more, and if you find in this man nothing common with Plautilla, it could be a reason to consider some other one. The Musei Vaticani should be more cautious when labelling this bust "Plautianus".
     
  13. Spaniard

    Spaniard Well-Known Member

    @Ryro.....Nice write up thanks!...And some lovely coins shown!
    Plautilla AR Denarius. 20mm/2.66gr minted 204 AD
    Obverse-PLAVTILLA AVGVSTA, draped bust right
    Reverse- VENVSVICTRIX, Venus standing left holding apple (pomegranite) & palm, leaning on shield,winged Cupid at her feet holding apple or pomegranite or helmet?...RIC# 369


    normal_PLAUTTOGETHER.jpg
     
  14. dougsmit

    dougsmit Member

    Don't forget to allow for the fact that she also has coins from an Eastern mint ('Laodicea').
    rm6930bb0977.jpg
     
  15. Tejas

    Tejas Well-Known Member

    True, maybe this is not a different hairstyle but a different interpretation by an eastern mint. I guess we can say with some confidence, that Plautilla appears with (at least) three different hairstyles on her coins. I think this is still remarkable and unusual.
     
  16. Cucumbor

    Cucumbor Well-Known Member

    Beautiful OP acquisition @Ryro !!

    A few years ago I made an attempt to collect all and every type of her denarii by hairstyle and reverse.

    There are five main types of portrait for Plautilla’s denarii at the Rome mint :
    A - With a draped bust right, hair coiled in horizontal ridges and fastened in bun in high position. Her facial expression is juvenile
    B - Hair being coiled in vertical ridges, with bun in low position. Plautilla looks here more like a young beautiful woman
    C - The third bust shows a thinner face of Plautilla with hair in vertical ridges and no bun but braids covering her neck
    D - The fourth type has a similar appearance with the former, but the vertical ridges disappear, hair being plastered down, still showing the right ear
    E - Plautilla appears with mid long hair plastered down and covering her ears

    In the mean time there are seven different reverses :
    1 - CONCORDIAE AETERNAE
    2 - PROPAGO IMPERI
    3 - CONCORDIA AVGG
    4 - CONCORDIA FELIX
    5 - PIETAS AVGG
    6 - VENVS VICTRIX
    7 - DIANA LVCIFERA

    Not every combination exists, but some of the above reverses can be shared by several obverse portraits. Noticeable also is an evolution of the obverse legend, being PLAVTILLAE AVGVSTAE (a) in 202, and becoming PLAVTILLA AVGVSTA (b) soon after

    And here's a virtual tray of the whole series : Rome mint, Laodicaea mint, and just for the pleasure of showing it, a Caesarea drachm that, after staying a while in my collection, and after some travelling, has ended now in @curtislclay's collection

    0191-a01b.JPG

    Q
     
  17. eparch

    eparch Well-Known Member

    The best of mine :

    upload_2021-11-4_9-3-40.png

    Plautilla (wife of Caracalla) AR Denarius. Rome, AD 202.
    PLAVTILLAE AVGVSTAE, draped bust right
    PROPAGO IMPERI, Plautilla and Caracalla clasping hands.

    RIC 362 (Caracalla);
     
  18. Severus Alexander

    Severus Alexander find me at NumisForums

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  19. ambr0zie

    ambr0zie Dacian Taraboste

    Instead of Plautilla I posted a Julia Paula. I don't confuse them. Note to self - check 2 times after a looooong working day.
    upload_2021-11-5_18-27-34.png

    PLAUTILLA (Augusta, 202-205) AR Denarius. Rome.
    Obv: PLAVTILLA AVGVSTA - draped bust right.
    Rev: VENVS VICTRIX - Venus standing left, holding apple and palm frond, and resting elbow upon shield decorated with hourglass(?); to left, Cupid standing left, holding helmet.
    RIC 369 (Caracalla)
    3,24 g, 19 mm
     
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