Conder101 and I spent a little time yesterday at a coin show looking at this piece I bought. From our discussion I think we both thought "wow it sure looks real in hand but it almost looks too nice". I got a heck of a deal on this piece if genuine. The seller of the piece had another coin for sale as well. It was an 1865 Indian head cent in an PCGS G6 15% Off Center and he wanted $100 more then I paid for this piece. So I either bought one of the best looking fake errors I have ever seen... or I got a heck of a deal.
Its a beauty if its real, almost looks to perfect. Wonder what the circular indentation is outside the nose and lower forehead. Does it weigh correctly?
AAhh I forgot to mention it appears to be struck by clashed dies... the circular indention is the clash from the "C" in cents and it does weigh correctly.
Wow. Nice find. There also appears to be a die-clash on the reverse. Starting below the base of the "C" in Cent and working upwards you can see the outline of the face.
That is a "C" from cent. That coin has had a major die clash. You can also see Liberty's face on the reverse most prominently through the "C" in cent. Here is a picture with the 2 side overlayed.
I see nothing to indicate it's fake. As you know, broadstrikes often create amazingly detailed strikes, and this would appear to be a good example of that.
Sorry guys, I think it is a fake. Could be Chinese in origin. The way the details meet the fields has me worried. Everything is too flat, so to speak, in my humble opinion. It would probably fool some graders but I think it's potentially a fake. I also don't like the looks of the hair under the headband and the details in the feathers look poorly duplicated. As well as key coins, they are making errors. This shows some of the thousands of fake Indians that were (are) made. http://coins.about.com/od/worldcoins/ig/Chinese-Counterfeiting-Ring/Fake-Indian-Head---Large-Cents.htm Read this one, this talks about fake errors and fake slabs: http://gnpov.wordpress.com/2009/05/19/china-and-their-counterfeits-of-us-coins/ Thanks, Bill
Bill, Both Conder and I discussed this. We had discussed how the Chinese counterfeits normally show this and this piece doesn't appear to in hand. I think it's my lighting making it look flat. I have been studying the Chinese counterfeits for a couple of years both regularly struck counterfeits and the errors they are making as well. I didn't notice anything in hand to make me immediately jump to Chinese counterfeit. Not saying anyone is right or wrong here... I think this one might just warrant a trip to NGC.
Matt, Remember The penny lady's new variety? Take a look around the ears on this coin and see what you think.
I saw that too. Tho her piece was an 1862. But yes it does appear to have very similar die polishing marks IMO.
Hi, Can you post some other pictures with different lighting? Also, I am sorry to say that I would go with a grader that has a better track record with errors and die varieties. I would point out that a major grader for that company wrote about a doctored coin in the Numismatist in 2009. It was a "1910 D" Lincoln cent that in his article he declared to be a 1910 with an added D. The writer of the article (NGC grader/authenticator) even added a line stating that he viewed the D under high magnification and could see where it was added to the field of the coin. I subsequently identified the coin as a 1940 D with an altered 4. The Numismatist published my images and my analysis of the coin. The space between the 9 and 1 of the date was way too wide on the coin shown by the "expert grader" in his article indicating the the 4 was altered. The Numismatist endorsed my analysis and pointed out that the previous article was wrong. The point is that simple things get by some graders of errors and die varieties and they can have trouble with the simple stuff. They even claim things that are not accurate to give weight to their opinion. Anyway, I have my doubts about the above IHC, I will also say that I could be out in the ozone but the coin looks too suspicious to me. Even the toning looks too even and artificial. It is very unnatural in my humble opinion. Thanks, Bill
