I'M FAT AND SOME OF MY COINS TOO...

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by Ocatarinetabellatchitchix, Oct 21, 2021.

  1. Ocatarinetabellatchitchix

    Ocatarinetabellatchitchix Well-Known Member

    I gained 50 pounds during the pandemic; I'm now weighting 180 lbs. Not too bad you may think. But since I'm only 4'10, my BMI is now 37.6... What does that mean ?
    The link between body weight and health has been generally acknowledged. Many studies have shown that being overweight and underweight can both lead to health problems. A person’s healthy weight is determined using the body mass index (BMI) and waist circumference. BMI is a simple correlation between weight and height. Once calculated, it can help to assess the risk of developing various diseases over time. The BMI is defined as the body mass divided by the square of the body height, and is expressed in units of kg/m², resulting from mass in kilograms and height in metres. Here are the meaning of your results:

    Underweight = <18.5

    Normal weight = 18.5–24.9

    Overweight = 25–29.9

    Obesity = BMI of 30 or greater

    So 180 lbs is not necessarily fat, but compare to my height I'm chubby obese.

    5D8943E2-5421-4F5D-9935-2157A50511CB.png
    Fernando Botero sculpture in Yerevan Armenia

    I also own coins that are overweight, meaning heavier compared to other specimens of the same issue or type. In antiquity, how did the master of the workshop ensure that each coins produced was of equal weight? It all started with the blanks before stamping. Experimental archeology seems to indicate that the only way to obtain calibrated weights is to melt a number of very small balls, the weight of which has itself been checked beforehand. These very small balls can be made by throwing molten metal into cold water through a screen.

    8524EC56-381D-4C1B-8CA3-74EB661F8484.jpeg
    G.F. Hill, 1922 p.6

    In the case of excessive weight, we can still lighten the flan before the strike, as we see on many republican coins reworked with the gouge. In practice, the control was not the same depending on the metal. To use medieval terminology, if the gold coins and probably silver were weighed al pezzo, meaning by the piece, the bronze coins were in turn weighed al marco, meaning together according to a number determined for a measure of weight (eg. Roman pounds). There was obviously a tolerance measure accepted for each of the emissions.

    In summary, the master of the workshop had to work according to a theoretical weight on the one hand, an emission tolerance on the other. He had to produce a determined number of coins from a unit of weight while ensuring, in the case of gold and silver, that the weight of each copy was not below a certain threshold.

    But in some cases, often cause by the political situation, the weight of certain issue had a wide tolerance compare to the average standard. I'll show three obvious example in my collection, two of them from the Gallic Empire and the last one from Philip the Arab.

    ABE296DE-7779-4D5B-B030-33B9973CB2D3.jpeg

    Victorinus VICTORIA AVG 5.25g

    The average weight of 41 specimens in the Mairat PhD is 3.07g, with the world record (?) at 5.65g for this type. Mine has a weight 68% heavier than the standard Victoria


    95C90414-82FA-4735-8986-ABA5EA0C16B2.jpeg

    Postumus HERC PACIFERO 4.84g

    The average Postumus' weight with this reverse is 3.51g based on 34 examples. I missed the world record by 0.02g... I knew I overcleaned it !


    E393E450-A85A-4014-8E85-9FBFE8161C66.jpeg

    Philip the Arab SALVS AVG 6.19g

    I don't know why but these antoniniani have a very large variation in their weights. The average measured on 20 coins of the same type is 4.5g. This time I believe I won the gold medal with my coin weighting 38% more than the standards !

    There has been many threads in the past about heavyweight coins, but today PLEASE SHOW US YOUR OVERWEIGHT (FAT) COINS for their types !
     
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  3. TIF

    TIF Always learning.

    Here's a chonkey antoninianus that looks like three flans melted together before striking. Kevin's handiwork, no doubt :D.

    Don't remember where it came from. A mixed lot, probably.

    [​IMG]
    Tetricus antoninianus, 17 x 19 mm, 3 mm thick, 6.4 gm
    RIC 90?
     
  4. john-charles

    john-charles Member

    I also own coins that are overweight, meaning heavier compared to other specimens of the same issue or type. In antiquity, how did the master of the workshop ensure that each coins produced was of equal weight? It all started with the blanks before stamping. Experimental archeology seems to indicate that the only way to obtain calibrated weights is to melt a number of very small balls, the weight of which has itself been checked beforehand. These very small balls can be made by throwing molten metal into cold water through a screen.


    In the case of excessive weight, we can still lighten the flan before the strike, as we see on many republican coins reworked with the gouge. In practice, the control was not the same depending on the metal. To use medieval terminology, if the gold coins and probably silver were weighed al pezzo, meaning by the piece, the bronze coins were in turn weighed al marco, meaning together according to a number determined for a measure of weight (eg. Roman pounds). There was obviously a tolerance measure accepted for each of the emissions.

    In summary, the master of the workshop had to work according to a theoretical weight on the one hand, an emission tolerance on the other. He had to produce a determined number of coins from a unit of weight while ensuring, in the case of gold and silver, that the weight of each copy was not below a certain threshold.

    They also used carob seeds which tend to weigh .2 grams in most cases.
     
  5. Victor_Clark

    Victor_Clark all my best friends are dead Romans Dealer

    struck with two flans stuck together...so double normal weight and 3mm thick


    Lyons_90.jpg

    Constantine II
    A.D. 320
    19mm 5.8g
    D N CONSTANTINO IVN NOB C; laureate, draped and cuirassed bust right.
    VICTORIAE LAET PRINC PERP; two Victories stg., facing one another, together holding wreath inscribed VOT PR on altar.
    in ex. P two captives L
    RIC VII Lyon 90
     
  6. Ocatarinetabellatchitchix

    Ocatarinetabellatchitchix Well-Known Member

    Wow that's fat. According to Cunetio hoard, average of 2.34g for the LAETITIA AVG N issue. The heavier recorded is 5.30g.......................
    I think we have a winner !
     
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  7. singig

    singig Well-Known Member

    my fattest antoninianus

    Carinus, AE Antoninianus, Antioch mint. RIC 325, S
    IMP C M AVR CARINVS PF AVG, radiate, cuirassed bust right. /
    VIRTVS AVGG, Carinus standing right, holding sceptre, receiving Victory on globe from Carus standing left. S in lower centre. Mintmark XXI. RIC V-2, 325; Sear 12362.
    21 mm / 6.3 g
    carinus1.jpg carinus1-side.jpg
     
  8. Hrefn

    Hrefn Well-Known Member

    upload_2021-10-21_20-37-39.png upload_2021-10-21_20-38-58.png
    A standard dinar of Haroun al Rashid is to the left, for size comparison.

    Multiple dinar of the last Abbasid caliph, al-Musta’sim 1242-1258 AD, of 645 AH (1247-8 AD) MWI 266. This coin’s mass is 13.22 grams, exactly 3 times the mass of the theoretical dinar of 4.4 grams which equaled the Byzantine Solidus. Of the 17 specimens on Zeno, this outweighs them all. https://www.zeno.ru/showgallery.php?cat=5605 Minted in the capitol, Medinat-as-Salam (Baghdad). In 1258 AD, the Mongols sacked the city and executed al-Musta’sim. Various stories are told of his death, including his being wrapped in a carpet and trampled by an elephant, to avoid shedding royal blood. Purchased in Boston in the early 1990’s from an unrecorded seller.
     
  9. JayAg47

    JayAg47 Well-Known Member

    Not an ancient, but this Ottoman Yüzlük (100 paras) of Selīm III is the heaviest I've come across (and the only one I own), definitely overweight at 33.14 g compared to it's counterparts! Yuzluk.jpg
     
  10. Ed Snible

    Ed Snible Well-Known Member

    670449.jpg
    Tetradrachm (17.04 gm). Arados mint. Civic issue, dated city year 59 (201/0 BC).
    Obv: Head of Herakles right, wearing lion's skin headdress
    Price 3389; Same obverse die as British Museum 1857, 1218.8
    Ex CNG 67, September 2004, lot 449.
    Ex Classical Numismatic Group 57 (28 March 2001), lot 226.
     
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  11. mrweaseluv

    mrweaseluv Supporter! Supporter

    my thickest don't quite qualify as ancients but fit the description too well not to share... Oh and added my pocket piece beside one for size comparison lol... :D 20211021_215810_HDR.jpg 20211021_215849_HDR.jpg 20211021_215953_HDR (2).jpg 20211021_221357.jpg
     
    Last edited: Oct 21, 2021
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  12. Numiser

    Numiser Well-Known Member

    I wonder if Fernando Botero created the Bob's Big Boy statue?

    BigBoy_Vintage_proof.jpg

    My fattest coin is the 2 oz Frankenstein silver round.
    2-oz-silver-hr-round-vintage-horror-series-frankenstein_208320_rev.jpg

    .
     
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  13. zumbly

    zumbly Ha'ina 'ia mai ana ka puana

    7.15g Claudius II Kevin Special:
    Claudius II - FJ Col Jupiter heavy 2579b.JPG CLAUDIUS II GOTHICUS
    AE Antoninianus. AE Antoninianus. Struck on a broad and extremely heavy flan. 7.15g, 27.1mm. Rome mint, circa end AD 268 - end AD 269. New RIC V/1 Online temp #262. O: IMP C CLAVDIVS AVG, radiate and cuirassed bust right. R: IOVI STATORI, Jupiter standing left, holding long sceptre in right hand and thunderbolt in left hand.7.15g, 27.1mm. Rome mint, circa end AD 268 - end AD 269. New RIC V/1 Online temp #262. O: IMP C CLAVDIVS AVG, radiate and cuirassed bust right. R: IOVI STATORI, Jupiter standing left, holding long sceptre in right hand and thunderbolt in left hand.
    Ex Finn Johannessen Collection; ex Emporium Hamburg 56 (30 Nov 2006) lot 556

    Not sure if mine is the heaviest one out there, but a 12-15g examples of Trajan Decius sestertii seem alot more common than this 28g chonkster:
    Trajan Decius - Sestertius Dacia heavy ex Behnen 1958.jpg
    TRAJAN DECIUS
    AE Sestertius. 28.32g, 32.7mm. Rome mint, AD 249-250. RIC 112a (scarce); Cohen 18. O: IMP C M Q TRAIANVS DECIVS AVG, laureate, cuirassed bust right. R: DACIA, Dacia standing left holding staff surmounted by a wolf-like head (draco); S-C in field.
    Ex Behnen Collection (acquired from Coin Galleries, 24 June 1966)

    RIC gives a weight range of 4-5.5g for this particular Jupiter standing issue of Licinius, making this 7.4g quite an outlier:
    Licinius - Iovi Nicomedia c 311 heavy 2343.jpg
    LICINIUS I
    AE Follis. 7.41g, 22.8mm. Nicomedia mint, circa AD 311. RIC VI Nicomedia 69a corr. (no eagle at feet). O: IMP C VAL LICIN LICINIVS PF AVG, laureate head right. R: IOVI CONS-ERVATORI, Jupiter standing left, chlamys hanging behind, holding Victory on globe and sceptre; A in right field, SMN in exergue.
    Ex Giovanni Dattari Collection (1853-1923)

    Heaviest Postumus ant, 5.98g:
    Postumus - Horned Rhine 3253.jpg POSTUMUS
    Billon Antoninianus. 5.98g, 23.9mm. Trier mint, 1st emission, 2nd phase, AD 260-261. RIC V 87; Mairat 1; AGK 88c; RSC 355b. O: IMP C POSTVMVS P F AVG, radiate, draped, and cuirassed bust right. R: SALVS PROVINCIARVM, horned river-god Rhine reclining left, resting on urn, holding anchor and resting hand on prow.
     
  14. Cucumbor

    Cucumbor Well-Known Member

    Some impressive fatties out there !

    My heaviest Gordian III is 6,95 gr and 25 mm (I didn't calculate its BMI though.... :) )

    [​IMG]
    Rome mint, 5th emission, AD 05-243/02-244
    IMP GORDIANVS PIVS FEL AVG, radiate, draped and cuirassed bust right, seen from behind
    SECVRITAS PERPETUA, Securitas standing left, holding scepter and resting on column
    6,95 gr, 25 mm
    Ref : RIC #153, RCV #8661, Cohen #336, Michaux #409
    Ex FORVM ancient coins

    Q
     
  15. Al Kowsky

    Al Kowsky Well-Known Member

    View attachment 1380944 View attachment 1380940 View attachment 1380940
    NGC 4252553-039 AK Collection.jpg
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2021
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  16. Deacon Ray

    Deacon Ray Artist & Historian Supporter

    This coin is one of my thickest provincials but weighs 14.36g which is within normal range for these.

    NERO_ANTIOCH.jpg


    Great post, Ocatarinetabellatchitchix !

     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2021
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  17. Al Kowsky

    Al Kowsky Well-Known Member

    That's a great portrait coin & painting of Nero; he looks like a hog sniffing for truffles.
     
  18. ancient coin hunter

    ancient coin hunter 3rd Century Usurper

    Here's my heaviest Gordian...not actually as heavy as some of the above examples....

    Gordian III, A.D. 238-244

    AR Antoninianus, 24mm, 4.9 grams

    Rome mint, A.D. 241-243

    Obverse: IMP GORDIANVS PIVS FEL AVG; Radiate, draped, and cuirassed bust right

    Reverse: PM TRP III CIS II PP; Apollo seated left, holding laurel branch and leaning on lyre

    Reference: RIC IV 114

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  19. hotwheelsearl

    hotwheelsearl Well-Known Member

    I gained over 30 pounds placing me over 150; ever since I was 18 I was consistently 120-130 pounds and fit, now I just have a gigantic beer belly.

    Here's my fattest head:
    Licinius I RIC VII 8 (2020_11_18 03_38_31 UTC).JPG
     
  20. ancient coin hunter

    ancient coin hunter 3rd Century Usurper

    I've gained some pounds since Covid. I am 6' 2" and 200 pounds (since high school) now at 220, with a few pounds to shed.
     
  21. John Anthony

    John Anthony Ultracrepidarian

    Great idea for a thread. I got fed-up with myself (so to speak) and set out to lose weight last summer. Down 55 pounds from 257 to 202, knocking on the door to "onederland." A friend of mine turned me on to NOOM, a diet/exercise app, but like all fitness programs, you have to really want it. I used to old, fat, and homely. Now I'm just old and homely. :)
     
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