recovered 20K in silver coins

https://www.wiscnews.com/baraboonew...cle_69c16f36-ee6e-5439-9671-b61b433bbec8.html

 

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I wonder how this will play out? I'm thinking the shop owner will have to give the silver back to the victim and try to collect from Tiffany, making the shop owner the new victim.

 

Jim [the dealer] is probably screwed

 

Was that due dilergence on the part of the deal?

 

Don't forget, the OP has posted on numerous threads that the only way to stop numismatic crime is to stop the Crooked dealers from colluding with criminals to purchase stolen coins.

Another crooked dealer gets what they deserve.

Or, did it ever occur to the OP that the Dealer may have reported the crime to the police. The story doesn't specifically say this, but it says the address of owner was on the container. Also note that the police were involved quickly. The sale happened 8/17 and the arraignment was approx 6 weeks later. Some states have required hold times and reporting requirements for pawned and precious metals as well. Was the arrest due to excellent detective work flushing out or crooked dealer, or did the dealer follow the rules and report something shady?

Maybe the dealer was the good guy in all of this and may end up getting screwed if he can't recover. But that can't be right. It doesn't fit the OPs narrative.

 

Jim has been a dealer for many years, in fact I have bought from him.

[Red Books of course. ]

 

I have too, back in the pre-internet dark ages when he ran big ads in Numismatic News and Coin World

 

he should have been extremely suspect the way they came in, and how they wanted to be paid for it all. $10K cash and a check for each of them? come on now, he should have known better, not saying its' not possible to inherit all that, but slow it down buddy, or pass and let it go to someone else. but two randoms off the street, looking like them, sketchy as hell story and run around to avoid a paper trail,
just saying even the scrap metal yard would have told them no if they showed up with 20K in copper. he hustles to get them the money same day?
it was too good for him to be legit and he should have smelled it coming, but overlooked the warning signs instead.

Sorry, I don't know if the dealer is the good guy or another bad guy but he certainly should have known better. he could have stalled them a day or two, and got their contact info, then called to police to check it out if he was concerned about stolen goods, even had a cop show up when they returned in a day or so.
Worst case they go somewhere else and he's not out $20K+. now he's going to have to sue them and get a judgement they will never pay, all because he was in a hurry to make a sketchy deal. if it was an inheritance, then why the rush, give it a day, there might be better dates in there and say you'll make a fair offer for the lot that might turn out better than $22 each.

he's a victim of his own making, buyer beware.

 

Well imagine being a dealer and having to deal with this yourself. It’s easy to trash them but it’s not like he had two weeks to prepare for these guys coming in and how to handle it at that moment. Do nothing and they walk. Sure he could have refused and the next guy would have to deal with it . What does the next guy do? Maybe he’s not willing or able to risk the loss and becomes the bad guy that splits it up and re-sells?

What’s the proper thing to do? Put them in a headlock? hold them at gunpoint for the police to come? What if you’re wrong?
Or, don’t buy anything and tell the police to follow them and “check into it”? Yeah, like that’s going to happen these days. Easy to criticize but no easy real solution.

 

Well said.

 

He had a lifetime to deal with it. It is part and parcel of being a dealer.

 

It is very simple and not difficult at all. Know what you are buying and don't buy stolen coins as it is a crime to do so.

 

It may be part of the deal. But it isn't the full deal. If you want a dealer to be part of the game reimburse him for his time and financial loss. right now we ar paying the work force to stay at home. no excuses. Have you ever thought abought the profit. Not all these coin sales are thieved, think about that. The dealer did the right thing.
<ore should be done for the small guy just trying to do business, and none of this 600 limit on doing business.

 

Let's pretend in a perfect fantasy world that all the dealers teamed up and did exactly as you ask, making a strong commitment not to buy anything that even seems questionable. Now they're not only not buying questionable items but also cutting out legitimate business as well out of an abundance of caution. Will this help the hobby? Are the criminals simply going to give up or will they adapt and get smarter? Eventually all transactions would have to end to prevent a few stolen coins from ending up in the market. Most of the time you can judge the proper path based on percentages.

 

You do realize that buying hot goods isi illegal and imorral. So there is no point in going into ... lets suppose it means it affects fair business. It is supposed to affect fair business by making it safer for everyone to be in the hobby without getting robbed. Nearly every stolen coin ends up back in the market and there are mutlple mechanisms which legitimate auciton houses and dealers help to make this happen. And this has to stop. The emphaisis has to be to protect everyone by assuring a clean market and ending, as best as possible, the illegal trade in stolen goods.

This activity happens all the time. The dealer just got caught with his pants down. They would have found no problem finding another dealer.

 

We don't have enough information. The dealer could have been working with the police from the start. We have no way of knowing.

 

And if he is like most dealers he would have required proper photo id's from both of them and kept records. Especially paying them $10K in cash. The government keeps a pretty close eye on coin dealers as part of their anti cash laudering measures. Banks aren't the only ones who have to report $10K cash transactions. It is quite possibly the dealer helped nail them. As mentioned we don't have all the details.

 

I sure hope @cplradar doesn't get called for jury duty. He'd hand them before the trial even started. Talk about impartial.

 

Any attorney worth their salary would easily read his transparency during the voir dire and send him on his way. I know I wouldn't want him in my jury box. He doesn't listen to facts.