ok, by request, I took the coin from the 2x2 and here are some of the best pics I could get. the first two are to show the luster and surfaces. The third is more for accuracy, as when I started to photograph it, these hairlines became rather apparent. Please do enjoy and offer your grade opinions.
I can't say that I disagree, Doug. It is an MS coin and it has been cleaned. Harshly, well, that's an argument for a different day. I bought this coin when I was much less experienced and as with many lessons in my life has not come to me without a price. The coin is still a very nice coin, and I think it has MS-64 details, but washed out luster.
Please explain what you see that lends you to believe that it has been harshly cleaned. I am not disagreeing with you, I just want to be educated! I am collecting Peace Dollars myself and want to learn these things!
He's referring to the lack of luster on the reverse in particular. The coin looks white, even bright, but has a dull appearance to it. I also disagree with the use of the term harsh, but cleaned, yes. Without question.
Ive been collecting Peace dollars for about 15 years. I have an NGC cert 1921 that has a dull luster too. In reading, I think that was more due to the minting problem they had with it. Mine is MS63. The reverse strike is very good on your coin. The scratches on the obverse look like slide marks to me.
See the pics I have attached. Hopefully that helps. Yes and no Mike. Yes, for a '21 Peace with that good of detail there should be a lot more luster. Look at the area I have circled in turquoise - that look the surfaces have is a dead give-away that the coin has been over-dipped. Now that, coupled with the fact that there does not appear to be 1 speck of toning, explains the lack of luster due to the coin being over-dipped. However, there are numerous hairlines and patches of hairlines on the coin. Yes, I agree that the heavy marks on the cheek could be due to slide marks. But all the hairlines (circled in red)- those aren't slide marks. They could be due to rough handling, or they could be due to somebody trying to clean the coin with a cloth or brush. We really never have any way of knowing exactly what caused the marks. We only know that they are there and thus they are most often attributed to harsh cleaning. That said, the TPG's will designate harsh cleaning whether it is due to actually abrasive cleaning - or - over-dipping. Basically anything that destroys the luster is considered as harsh cleaning.
Oddly, I haven't disagreed with a word of your assessment. As originally stated, the coin was overdipped. For your edification, there is asome really dark toning on the coin near Liberty's Tiara (for lack of a better term). It's in one of the better protected places on the surface and is only there if you really look closely. More evidence of cleaning. This, along with my 3-leg are reminders of how much I have learned and have yet to learn. I never stop trying to expand my numismatic knowledge and become a better grader. It's a shame that this coin was cleaned. It has a really nice strike for a 1921.
:hug: it is still a great coin and i dont think it was harshly cleaned if it was that coin it is not showing it. doug can say and draw what he likes . and i respect hes op a lot .but have to disagree . i still really like the coin. and as far peace dollars go that is a great coin. dave ps still looking for one
