PCGS sub has arrived - Guess the Grade (Part 2 of 5)

I was on the fence about it. The NGC images are what really made it seem more 3 dimensional. I've seen Morgans with that look before. You could be right on it.

 

Log in or Sign up to hide this ad.

65 to 65

 

Looks nice with good color but, in my experience, both grading companies hate coins with dull luster. That obverse seems a bit flat.

NGC: MS63

PCGS: MS64

 

We had some people come close but this was a tricky one.
NGC originally called this Unc Details - Artificial Toning (which I disagreed with-the color looks market acceptable). PCGS agreed that the color was fine and gave it an MS 63. While there aren't many hits, the toning has dulled the luster. As mentioned by @Sunflower_Coins that lack of strong luster prevented a higher grade. One could argue the merits of a 63 vs 64 but I'm satisfied with the straight grade (this was a better result than part 1 of 5).

 

Part 3 is now posted here:
https://www.cointalk.com/threads/pcgs-sub-has-arrived-guess-the-grade-part-3-of-5.385091/

 

I completely agree with you it should've passed,a big disappointment.

 

Luckily I bought it already in the NGC holder, so I didn't spend any money on the NGC grading fees (it stinks for the person who originally sent it in though).

 

Bummer. I thought about UNC/AT but the high grades other posters suggested influenced my decision. I think NGC nailed it.

 

I don't think NGC was close here (well besides the UNC part, that was right). The toning looks like it would come from either being in a leather pouch or an album for an extended period. This type of color is market acceptable.

 

The term "market acceptable" bothers me to no end as far as grading is concerned. I've run into this with coppers such as Indian Head Cents. A coin that is graded unc details by PCGS has a chance to straight grade at NGC. I actually agree with NGC in most instances. However, the thing that bothers me is that what's market acceptable today may not be tomorrow. Obviously, these no longer market acceptable coins would still be out their in their original slabs along with the new market acceptable ones. So the phrase, "buy the coin, not the holder", will have even more meaning.

 

I hear you and agree that "market acceptable" can be a problematic term. In this case, I was using it instead of natural toning because I can't prove the coin naturally toned (I wasn't there for its entire existence). However, I don't think it is artificial since I've seen similar examples and it does not have the look of something that was "processed" by a "doctor" (some of those blue/purple copper Indian Head and Lincoln cents do looks processed...those have been mostly considered market acceptable by NGC and I disagree with that assessment).

 

I have no clue whether this Morgan $ has "Artificial Toning", but it looks like a fairly unattractive coin to me--It's not some "beautiful" toning IMO. Also I know from bitter experience how hit-or-miss PCGS grading can be, so I'd say you lucked out.

I'd also say this whole saga shows the vagaries of TPG grading......

 

I am not a fan of "Toning". I have about 20+ Morgans and several of them have a slight coloring around the edge of the coins. To me, I like coins that are closest to the day they were released. From what I have seen of coins that have "Toned", the seem to lose their appeal.

 

66 and too dark for my taste.

 

MS-64

 

Everyone is different and that's what makes things fun. I like some coins blast white but I also enjoy colorful coins. I even like some of the modern colorized coins. Each one has a certain appeal to me; others may not feel the same way and that's perfectly fine.

 

Eye appeal is subjective; some people will find this coin attractive while others won't. I've seen a few similarly toned examples go for several times price guide so there are people out there that value this type of color.

And I was fairly confident that this coin would get a straight grade as there are other similar examples that have graded. But it is never guaranteed, so I will take the positive outcome (I've had my share of poor grading results, so it is nice to get a few victories too).

 

O think you are seeing the effects of what is called over dipping, or the beginning signs of the cleaned designation. I would be the first on the list to say, replace those coins with better ones. A cleaned coin will always be cleaned. Also saying BW coins are hardly ever, if, ever truly considered original. Coins tone from the second they were minted, some started in the basing process. BW does not mean original, it actually with Morgan's means the opposite.

 

Not a fan of the coloring myself