If u have a coin from the us mint that is still in the sealed mint shipping box and shipped within the shutoff date for early release, can u still get a early release pedagree?
If you're talking early release, I've never heard of that. If you're talking first strike, I'd say, if you can get a first strike designation because of a date on a box or roll or whatever, I just lost faith in the TPG'ers. Just because a coin box or roll was one of the first released, is no guarantee it was one of the first coins struck from a particular die - that can only be determined by close inspection of the coin.
Because of a legal settlement NGC was forced to use "early release" PCGS didn't participate in the settlement so they still use "first strike" You need to contact the TPGs re: their grading services.
statequarterguy...from each graders respective website on Early Release/First Strike, and First Day Issue: For PCGS First Strike..... There are two ways PCGS can verify if a coin was shipped out from the mint within the first 30 days. The first is when a coin is shipped to PCGS from the customer with a postmarked date before the cutoff date for that particular coin. In this example, PCGS only needs the coin to be mailed in. No extra mint packaging is needed (i.e. boxes, certificates, etc.). The second way PCGS can verify that a coin qualifies for First Strike designation is when a customer does not open the sealed package that came from the mint. In this instance, the package must remain completely sealed and unopened. The customer then can send that whole package in to PCGS and the receiving department will go by the postmarked date from the mint. As long as this date is prior to the cutoff date for that particular coin, it qualifies for first strike. PCGS First Day Issue: Special First Day of Issue inserts are available through the PCGS Bulk Submissions program for Presidential Dollar coins postmarked on their release date. Coins will also qualify after the release date if they are housed in original, mint-sealed boxes with a white seal bearing the name of the President and the official release date. Such boxes must also contain the date stamp of the Mint inspector. The same rules will apply to future Presidential Dollars unless the Mint makes changes in their packaging and sealing. Each order must contain a minimum of 100 coins (unless otherwise specified). For NGC, here's their rule on Early Release: To qualify for Early Releases designation all coins must be received by NGC within 30 days of their release by the US Mint, or documented as being received by an NGC approved depository within this same 30-day period. Coins being sent directly to NGC do not need to be accompanied by original packaging or shipped in sealed mint boxes, but must arrive within the time period described above. The Early Releases request must be noted on the submission invoice, and additional service fees apply for the special label and designation verification. For NGC First Day Issue.... NGC will designate FIRST DAY OF ISSUE on circulating US Coins that have an official release date. To qualify, coins must be received by NGC on the official release date or by overnight mail or air carrier on the day immediately following the official release date. Alternatively, coins still packed in sealed US Mint issue First Day Covers are eligible for this designation. Private issue covers are not accepted. Coins designated FIRST DAY OF ISSUE are encapsulated with regular format NGC labels.
WOW guess that's why I take a label as only that. The whole idea of a first strike is one should be getting a better quality coin if it were one of the first struck from a die, before the die begins to deteriorate from use. The date on a package means nothing as that package could include a coin struck at any point during a die's life, including the end. So many coins are struck that even a "first release" of coins includes coins struck by many dies that have run their entire useful life.
statequarterguy...you are right, in regard to 'First Strike'. The very very last coin struck from a set of dies could realistically (and more than likely has been, many times) be given a 'First Strike' designation. I don't particularly agree with it, but it's their ball and bat, so to speak.
First Strikes are always the best quality!! I have some real nice Presidential Dollars in 69 Deep Cameo!!
"The whole idea of a first strike is one should be getting a better quality coin if it were one of the first struck from a die, before the die begins to deteriorate from use. The date on a package means nothing as that package could include a coin struck at any point during a die's life, including the end. So many coins are struck that even a "first release" of coins includes coins struck by many dies that have run their entire useful life" Who can argue with that.
Thanks for all the replies: I see the point that a coin could be from any part of a run first or last but the first shipped has more of a chance being struck in the first run than any other so i think thats the only leg the graders have to stand on to give it that pedagree,But why the diff standard between grading services as to when it is sent in for grading,If its in a unopened box from the mint with all paper work inside the box that verify the date I feel there should be no cutoff date for a early release from NGC.
Not sure what your saying by, "A coin could be from any part of a run first or last but the first shipped has more of a chance being struck in the first run". What relevance does the run the coin is in have to the quality of the coin? First run coins would be produced with worn dies just as likely as a last run, since the first run of, say coins made for circulation, would comprise millions of coins taken from bins, produced from dies that saw their full life. I believe there was a write up in Coin World years ago explaining this process, which concluded that is why, even though uncirculated mint sets, made before satin finish coins in 2005, contained a fair share of poorly struck banged up coins, even though they were packaged from a sample of first run coins. So, what I'm seeing is coin promoters claiming "first run" or "first release" to somehow imply it's a better coin, yet in fact, per The Mint, this is not the case. I don't know, has The Mint's production procedures change for the better? Are they stopping the presses before a die has seen its full life and sending those coins out in the first release? I don't think so. Have the TPG'ers bought into this promotion? Is that why there was a lawsuit, because what really matters is, is a coin a first strike from a new die, not whether it’s from a “first run” or “first release”? Well, the fact is, one still has to look at the coin to determine if it’s a well made coin, not the date on the box. Speaking of satin finish coins produced in mint sets since 2005, now those are some well made coins - if they were made any better, they'd have to be called matte proofs.
Im talking proof coins only,If a coin is struck in a new die the quality will be better than if its struck in a die that has worn or deteratid,Of course u will still have to look @ the coin and grade from there, but in a new die the edges will be crisper as the die is new,It may only grade out @ proof 69 but still be a better coin graded proof 69 from the end of a run as the die starts to wear,thats why there is a first strike pedagree label. The matt finish coins imo arnt worth collecting as there jus not a eye catching coin for me.
Wheter or not the TPG will give a First Strike/Early Release designation to a coin still in the unopened box, with an early postmark varies depending on what the coin is. Some they will and some they won't because for those issues they also required that it be in their hands before a certain cutoff date.
The mint does not use dies worn out at all on any proofs, The mint does not use worn out dies at all on any proofs, it is true the earler strike will be better of course but they do not use worn dies for these. In fact if truly talking EDS or LDS coins I personally have never noticed a american eagle struck from worn dies - have any of you'all???
Although The mint does not use “worn out” dies for proofs, the dies still wear with each successive coin struck, so earlier strikes will look better. The first thing that deteriorates is the frosted devices which begin to show uneven frosting with areas that are shiny. Again, from statements made by The Mint, ordering proofs early does not guarantee first strike coins, as a run will include coins struck from dies in varying states of wear. I’ve seen this from personal experience when I’ve ordered proofs the first day of issue and later in The Mint’s last chance catalog – I’ve got some lousy ones from the first day of issue and some beauties from the last chance catalog. As for the satins, that’s each ones preference. I personally like the satins’ matte proof look better than the mirrored proofs. The mirrored proofs high contrast prevents the eye from processing all the detail of the relief, much like a camera doesn’t do well in situations of high contrast (bright sun combined with shade). Although satins are not made quite as well as the “unc version of modern commemoratives, they are darn close. Look at the modern commemorative series to get an idea of the potential of the satins. Without exception the Uncirculated version of the modern commemoratives is a lower mintage and carries a higher premium than the mirrored proof. This is because people “blindly” order proofs believing they are the better coins. However, the uncirculated version of the modern commemorative is actually produced like a proof, but with matte fields rather than mirrored, so in essence the uncs are matte proofs with a lower mintage. The satin coins in uncirculated mint sets since 2005 are very similar to matte proofs and like the modern commemoratives, these satin coins’ mintages are much lower than the mirrored proofs. So, you do the math. The modern unc commems and the new satin coins are perfect examples of buy the coin, not the label, much like the label “first release”.
Quite a interesting topic with what ngc will grade like when the silver eagle annavesary set came out they would not give a specific label unless the box was unopened,I thought that to be stupid as like u are all saying grade the coins not how the set came about so what if u swaped out the coin for another in the set it is still a set with the same 3 coins,if the box was opened they would only grade the reverse proof with a special label,Must be some bs there giving us as the consumer,Also I didnt mean to say the matt finish isnt worth collecting as the reverse proofs are astounding coins but u have the contrast between finishes that make it like eye candy, Realy I jus want to open the fricken boxes and see the coins i bought,Just dont want to loose any value added by not, I see on ebag a unopened mint box brings a higher auction price than one that has been opened,Is this jus human stupidity?
Yeah, the hobby has become a group of collectors of boxes, wrappers and labels, not coins. lol I see it in several areas, try telling your five year old he can't open the toy you just bought him because it will make it worth less. So, if you're a collector, you have to buy two, one to play with and one to keep unopened. As for the mirrored proof vs. matte/satin finish, I buy both, but prefer the matte/satin. Try this test, put a mirrored proof along side a satin of the same coin and look at both from a reasonable distance to see if you don't see more detail in the satin. With the mirrored proof I see super shiny surfaces and heavily frosted white blobs of raised areas and have to look closer to see detail in the devices, however the satin’s detail jumps out at me.
As for the higher prices paid for unopened boxes, that’s because a chance exists that there is a high mint state or variety/error coin in it, that hasn’t been cherry picked. At some point in that unopened box’s sales history, it will get opened by a collector that wants to take the chance and see if there’s a high mint state or variety/error coin in it, kinda like scratching a lottery ticket. I guess the boxes get opened quicker the larger the price difference between the unopened box and the high grade or variety/error coin potentially in the box. However, what the marketers have done is attempt to lead one to believe there is a higher chance of getting a high grade coin from a "first release", which is not the case.
