Medieval Monday!

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by FitzNigel, Sep 14, 2020.

  1. Silphium Addict

    Silphium Addict Well-Known Member

    First medieval purchase:
    comtat-d-empuries-hug-iv-Aureo367_2205.jpg
    Comtat d'Empúries
    Hug IV (1200-1230)
    Billon Diner 0.64 gm
    O: sword; IMPVRIAR around
    R: cross; +VGO COMS
    Cru.V.S. 97.1; Balaguer 106.5

    Reviewed this final series from the Emporion vicinity when preparing a presentation. so I finally got a nice example.
    Impurias (present day Sant Marti d’Empúries) was a fortified town built on the now landlocked Palaiapolis, original island settlement of Emporion. Comtat d’Empúries was a county of West Francia ruled by Count Hugh I and descendants as vassals of Barcelona 989-1325. Several counts minted billon diners and obols 1040-1325.
    Sant Marti d’Empúries is a charming village a short walk from the Ruins d’Empúries that maintains its medieval structures and walls. It has a couple of nice restaurants in the old square and is well worth exploring.
    W87D3P.jpg
    https://www.alamy.com/aerial-view-o...escala-in-catalonia-spain-image263236730.html
    View of Sant Marti d’Empúries with archaeologic site in background
     
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  3. FitzNigel

    FitzNigel Medievalist

    Very nice @Silphium Addict! And thanks for the reminder that today is Monday! I nearly forgot… I was looking through my coins to see if I also had a sword to share, but the only thing that comes close is the coin I shared last week. So how about a hand to hold the sword?

    Med-04-HRESH-1250-Schwäbisch Hall-HH-607.jpg HRE - Schwäbisch Hall
    Schwäbisch Hall (Mid 13th. Century)
    AR Handheller, 17.69 mm x 0.59 grams
    Obv.: [H]●A●L●L[●A●]. Hand in circle
    Rev.: Cross with forked end, pellet in each end, surrounded by pellets and crosses int he border
    Ref.: Saurmache 607, De Wit 2490
     
  4. +VGO.DVCKS

    +VGO.DVCKS Well-Known Member

    Magnificent example, @Silphium Addict.
    I'm just starting to get into Iberian feudal issues (only Barcelona so far, earlier and cruddier than this), and don't have anything remotely comparable. But I did just land this.
    CHAMPAGNE, PROVINS, HENRI  I, 1164-1181, OBV..jpg
    CHAMPAGNE, PROVINS, HENRI  I, 1164-1181, REV..jpg CHAMPAGNE, PROVINS, HENRI  I, 1164-1181, REV..jpg
    (My machine is not cooperating with only one pic of the reverse.)
    County of Champagne, Henri I (1152-1181). Provins, issued c. 1164-81.
    Obv. +HENRI COMES.
    Rev. Comb /peigne (right, canting for 'Champagne'). (From 3 o'clock: ) PRVVINS CASTRI. Adam 232-9; Roberts 4727, citing Poey d'Avant Pl. 138: 22, but extending the issue to Henri II, 1181-97.
    Haven't had one of Henri I since I was a kid. More than one other person has noted this, but Henri is probably the one who built the remarkable transitional donjon at Provins, known as le Tour de Cesar. During the same interval, Henry II d'Angleterre was experimenting with comparable designs, along with other kings and counts in France. (From Wikipedia: )
    [​IMG]
     
  5. +VGO.DVCKS

    +VGO.DVCKS Well-Known Member

    Very cool, @FitzNigel. I can't remember ever seeing one that wasn't 14th century or later. Thanks for the attribution --I always assumed these were from Halle, where Handel was from ('Handelsheller' -get it?), instead of the opposite side of the country.
     
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  6. FitzNigel

    FitzNigel Medievalist

    my attribution is based mostly off of this very informative thread by @Orielensis. I’m pretty clueless when it comes to the German coins, and is an area I am trying to improve…
     
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  7. +VGO.DVCKS

    +VGO.DVCKS Well-Known Member

    @FitzNigel, thanks for the reminder! Yes, a terrific thread, with a terrific OP. For one, it took the legendless variety back a little further, into the 13th century, than I'd always assumed.
     
    Last edited: Jul 26, 2021
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  8. seth77

    seth77 Well-Known Member

    Exquisite design and rare also.


    This series started so late in Henri's reign? Did Thibaut's coinage continue after 1152 and into Henri's reign? I'd wonder because Thibaut is not as common as Henri II or Thibaut IV.
     
  9. +VGO.DVCKS

    +VGO.DVCKS Well-Known Member

    Very good question, @seth77. Since the broader comital series is relatively underpublished (as we both know too well), Adam should have made some mention of this in his introductory remarks to the comital reign. For Henri I, Troyes and Provins both have variants, with the same chronological interval in operation. The earlier issues of both, from 1151, are in Henri's name, but continue Thibaut's obverse motif of the cross with an arrow and an Alpha and Omega in the angles. From 1164, Henri introduces the star, annulet and besants in their place. Presumably Adam has hoard evidence to draw on; Champagne is where he's based, and the center of his expertise.
    ...He does mention that 1164 marked Henri's marriage to Marie Capet, daughter of Louis VII and Eleanor d'Aquitaine.
    ...From here, it would also be fun to know something about when construction of the Tour de Cesar began. It's easy to imagine it coinciding with the particularly auspicious marriage. Even this early, castles were as much about propaganda as defense. There's prominent precedent in England back to the reign of Stephen (1135-1154). Following William d'Augigny, Earl of Arundel's marriage to Adeliza, the widow of Henry I, he built three particularly impressive and well-appointed keeps, at Castle Rising (rectangular /hall keep), Arundel (shell keep), and New Buckenham (the first round tower-keep built in England; as such, distinctly precocious for its time).
     
    Last edited: Jul 27, 2021
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  10. seth77

    seth77 Well-Known Member

    I really need to read that work. For instance this was presented by CGB as Henri II:

    bfe_401428.jpg

    Would a better likelyhood be Henri I early reign 1152-1164?
     
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  11. Spaniard

    Spaniard Well-Known Member

    .....Sorry only just seen this!.....Yep completely agree and a really nice example you've aquired!..Lovely dark toning with highlights!
    Congrats on a nice pick up:woot:
     
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  12. +VGO.DVCKS

    +VGO.DVCKS Well-Known Member

    Sorry for taking all day (even worse, Pacific time) to get to this, @seth77.
    To 'cut to the chase,' you're spot on. According to Adam, the only major variation between Henry I's first issue, and that of Henri II, is that on the reverse, to either side of the 'T' above the comb, Henri I has annulets, while Henri II has crescents. Otherwise, everything I can notice is effectively identical. ...Down to the besants in the angles of the obverse cross, which, in the CGB example, seem to have fallen prey to the diagonal 'ghosting' of the comb on the reverse. Zero variation in the legends, for another obvious instance.
    ...You could talk me into sending you some more scans of Adam, without trying very hard! ...I've yet to see any copies on the market, new or used, since the first printing, in 2018.
     
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  13. malinkyhoy

    malinkyhoy Member

    I know it’s not Monday but it’s been an eon since I posted here. This is my latest acquisition
     

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  14. +VGO.DVCKS

    +VGO.DVCKS Well-Known Member

    Magnificent example, @malinkyhoy. Yikes. Not just York; on the early side (just from Spink, #1015); c. 919-925. Replete with the iconic Thor's hammer and sword, the latter with a recognizable depiction of a distinctly Viking-style pommel.
    ...Wow. Liking it a Lot.
     
  15. FitzNigel

    FitzNigel Medievalist

    Nice One! Not easy to come by either!
     
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  16. seth77

    seth77 Well-Known Member

    So after the 'new' design introduced by Henri I in 1164, Henri II returned in the 1180s to the older ca. 1150s-1164 design, with the adagio of croissants instead of annulets. I would wonder how many hoards have to be sequenced to pinpoint these details to the periods in question. I'd really appreciate if you could scan some of Adam's work for Provins coinage in the 11-12th century. Thank you!
     
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  17. +VGO.DVCKS

    +VGO.DVCKS Well-Known Member

    ...On my way to work; if it looks as if I've forgotten to do this, write me!
     
  18. FitzNigel

    FitzNigel Medievalist

    My wife and I are currently traveling around Iceland to celebrate our 7th anniversary (today!). As such, I wanted to post something relevant, but medieval Iceland did not use coins as coins. Rather, their monetary unit of account was the lögeyrir, which was a length of cloth six ells long and two ells wide (or 2940mm x 980mm). In the eleventh century, Eight lögeyrir equaled one ounce of silver.

    Well, I have no medieval ells of cloth to share, but I do have some silver that would have been used in Scandinavian trade (with a full write-up here):
    Med-19a-Abb-0936-Al-Radi Billah-Dir-Marinate al Salam-255-1.jpg Abbasid Caliphate, Third Period
    Al-Radi Billah, r. 322-329 AH/934-940 A.D. (324 AH/936/7 A.D.)
    Marinate al Salam Mint (present day Baghdad), AR Dirhem, 27.08 mm x 3.0 grams
    Obv.: Outer Margin: لله الأمر من قبل و من بعد ويومئذ يفرح المؤمنون بنصر الله. Inner Margin: بسم الله ضرب هذا الدرهم بمدينة السلام سنة اربع و عشرين و ثلث مائة. Center: لا شريك له / الله وحده / لا الاه الا
    Rev.: Margin: محمد رسول الله ارسله بالهدى و دين الحق ليظهره على الدين كله ولو كره المشركون Center: د / الراضى بالله / الله / رسول / محمد / لله
    Ref.: Album 255.1 (Without Heir)
    Note: Holed. Potentially from the Vikings.

    While this coin lacks the distinctive peck marks that Scandinavians used to test the purity of the silver, these silver dirhams were used as jewelry by them, and would have been holed much like my example. In fact, while wandering through the National Museum of Iceland, just such a necklace was found on the island and put on display:
    59706670-0B09-461F-9B06-0F3DA688721A.jpeg While I don’t think there is any significance to it, I do find it interesting that the orientation of the text to the hole in the coins matched the orientation of my coin.

    There were two other interesting coin displays at the museum - one of which was a number of 3rd century Roman coins which were found at different norse settlements in the south and east of the island:
    EC0928A2-9AA9-43FF-AC3D-0C7DF4482E75.jpeg
    How and why some of the earliest settlers of Iceland would have these coins, I couldn’t begin to explain, especially since none of them even looked silver (the two that do here is due to my bad photography).

    Lastly, only one hoard of silver which contained coins has been found in Iceland. 360 silver coins, most of them from the reign of Æthelred II, suggesting this was a Danegeld payment:
    AC3D1C4A-595A-4927-8E3A-E78168A2BCDD.jpeg
    and here is the rest of the hoard which contained numerous pieces of random silver:
    00403F70-4F30-43E7-937A-4DA5C29E8825.jpeg
     
  19. svessien

    svessien Senior Member

    The early settlers of Iceland came from my area; the west coast of Norway. I asked one of the local archeaologists here if he knew if there were found a lot of Roman coins here, and if so; which was the earliest. He said that was a Hadrian denarius. So those 3rd century coins may come from trade with the continent, which was going on at least from the Scandinavian bronze age.

    How fun that you are on holiday in Iceland!

    I haven’t been buying a lot of medieval coins this year, but I have two new ones. None of them really classify as «European medieval», however:

    Great Seljuks gold.jpg

    Iran, Great Seljuqs

    Sanjar, as viceroy under Barkiyaruq AD 1097-1098/AH 490-492

    AV dinar, date off, Mint off, but Nishapur style.

    Reference: Album 1685. Wilkes 1834.

    Size: 18mm. Weight: 2,89g Crude as usual

    Sanjar, in full Muʿizz al-Dīn Sanjar, (born 1084/86—died May 8, 1157), Seljuqprince of Khorāsān from c. 1096 to 1157, whose fame almost eclipses that of the “Great Seljuqs” because of the length of his reign, his power and victories in its first half, his disasters in the second, and the fact that he was the last real Seljuq sultanin Iran.

    Appointed governor of Khorāsān by his half brother Berk-yaruq, who succeeded Malik-Shāh as sultan, Sanjar in fact acted as an independent prince throughout his reign and after the death of his full brother Muhammad in 1118 was regarded as the head of the Seljuq house. His longevity saved Khorāsān from the internecine struggles that destroyed the other Seljuq lines and enabled him to maintain an organized government in spite of the growing dangers that gathered around him.

    Sanjar established his suzerainty over the Turkish Qarakhanid princes of Transoxania and over the Ghaznavids of the Indian borderland. He entered Ghazna (Ghaznī) itself in 1117 and there installed his own nominee on the throne. Later, however, the insubordination of his viceroy Atsiz in Khwārezm (modern Khiva) and the appearance of a new and dangerous enemy in Transoxania eroded Sanjar’s position. His new enemy was the recently founded confederacy of Central Asian tribes under the Karakitai, with whom the Turkish Qarluqs of Transoxania made common cause. Sanjar suffered a terrible defeat near Samarkand in 1141; Transoxania was lost, and the Karakitai established a distant suzerainty over Khwārezm. Sanjar maintained his hold over Khorāsān in spite of Atsiz, but he had suffered a great loss of prestige and power; the fame of his defeat even reached Europe, where it took the form of the legend of Prester John, the Christian priest-king who was to destroy Islam (there were Nestorian Christians among the Karakitai). Finally there was an uprising of the Oğuz(Ghuzz) tribes in Sanjar’s realm. Although originally the instrument of the Seljuqid conquests, they had never accepted a centralized administration. In 1153 they captured the old sultan and kept him prisoner for two years, albeit with respect. He escaped but died without having restored order in Khorāsān.

    (Source: Britannica)

    Lorraine demi gros.jpg

    France, Lorraine. Duché, Antoine (1508-1544),

    AR gros, no date, Nancy.

    Obverse: Ecu couronné.

    Reverse: Bras armé sortant d''une nuée.

    Reference: Flon 598, 84; Saulcy XIV, 13; coll. Robert 1409.

    Size: Weight: 1,63g. Conservation: VF

    Antoine, known as the Good, was Duke of Lorraine from 1508 until his death in 1544. Raised at the French court, Antoine would campaign in Italy twice: once under Louis XII and the other with Francis I. During the German Peasants' War, he would defeat two armies while retaking Saverne and Sélestat. Antoine succeeded in freeing Lorraine from the Holy Roman Empire with the Treaty of Nuremberg of 1542. In 1544, while Antoine suffered from an illness, the Duchy of Lorraine was invaded by Emperor Charles V's army on their way to attack France. Fleeing the Imperial armies, Antoine was taken to Bar-le-Duc where he died.
     
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  20. malinkyhoy

    malinkyhoy Member

    Morning all
     

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  21. +VGO.DVCKS

    +VGO.DVCKS Well-Known Member

    Yipes, @malinkyhoy, a fantastic complement to @FitzNigel's post for the day. For those tuning in late, Look at the Pics!
    Gasp. Anlaf (/Olaf) Guthfrithsson, Hiberno-Norse king of York 939-954. Replete with the Norse raven on one side, and the much smaller cross on the other. Suggesting where Anlaf's primary loyalties lay.
    Here's an example of what, from here, is a 'brand new' count of Namur, in the duchy of Lower Lotharingia, in the Walloon /Francophone part of modern Belgium.
    NAMUR, ALBERT III, 1063 OR 4 -1102, DBG. 176, NAUMANN AUG. 21.jpg
    Namur, Albert III, 1063/4-1102. Denier /denar of Namur.
    Obv. Diademed profile left; (from 4 o'clock: ) A[LBERT]VS.
    Rev. Voided small cross, crescents in angles; (from 12 o'clock: ) [+dE]ON[A]M.
    Dannenberg 176.
    ...For comparison, here's one of his dad, Albert II. What sold this one was the relatively complete strike of the name on the obverse.
    COINS, PAYS-BAS, NAMUR, ALBERT II, BOTH SIDES.jpg
     
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