Hey everyone, just had a thought/question. As most of us know, the Spanish 8 reales was widely circulated in East Asia, particularly those produced out of Mexican mints. But would lower value reales, i.e. 1, 2 and 4 reales coins, have also been sent to East Asia for trade in similarly large quantities and been commonly accepted? I've found some auctions and forums that seem to have these non-8 reales with chopmarks, but any more info would be appreciated. Thanks! https://db.stevealbum.com/php/chap_auc.php?site=1&lang=1&sale=17&chapter=21&page=1 https://americanhistory.si.edu/collections/search/object/nmah_1830378 https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1005383/4-reales-the-hard-way
Silver minors were chopmarked, but they are hard to find. I have a couple of them, but unfortunately, I never got around to photographing them. I'm a bit rusty on my chopmark collecting knowledge, but I seem to recall Frank Rose discussing the topic - silver coins ("dollars/8 reales") were what the Chinese merchants and what European and American merchants were sending in for trade. But sometimes it seems that minor silver was used, either to "top off a keg" or the pocket change carried by sailors, merchants, etc. Rose speculates (again, as I recall) that most of the minor coins that the Chinese merchants obtained were melted down and not chopped. Thus the scarcity of chopped examples. From what I have seen, Spanish-Colonial minors (2 reales mostly) are most commonly encountered. For reasons I cannot explain, US half dollars are not all that uncommon with chops; the Seated Liberty types, with the ones I've seen dated in the 1850s. I have a small Straits Settlements 10 cents with a tiny chop. These and Hong Kong small silvers can be found with these tiny chops (check your local dealer's stock - they are not all that uncommon). The dates are much later than the Spanish-Colonial minors, and the chops minuscule. My guess (only a guess) is that there was some other mercantile practice involved here. Fake chops (and countermarks) are becoming a problem - chopping a common minor and making it a rare chopped specimen is a tempting way to make a dishonest buck. Thanks for sending those links - there is some good information there - my information dates back mostly from the pre-Internet era, which was a long time ago! Welcome to Coin Talk!
That's exactly what I was speculating as well--unless merchants in East Asia were still physically cutting up 8R's, some amounts of 1, 2 and 4 R coins must have circulated to round off payments, "top off a keg" etc. as you mention. I've also seen those chopped seated halves, wild. Thanks for the information!
I only have two chopped minors in my small collection, but here they are: Spain 1811 2 reales "pistareen" - these are found chopped from time to time. Spanish 2 reales have lower silver content than Spanish-Colonial 2 reales, but they did get chopped. Rose speculated on this, but I don't remember what he said ( I gotta find that book - it's around here somewhere!): Here's the Straits Settlement 1884 ten cents with two very small chops. Very small chops on minors from the SS and Hong Kong are found from time to time. This one was from my local dealer: Here it is again with a Straits Settlements dollar, for size comparison:
As an aside, it is also possible that chopmarked coins were later cur down after returning to the Americas in trade in East Asia, with some 'bits' retaining the chopmark, thus resulting in a chopmarked minor. This isn't my field of expertise, but I do remember reading in a few places that underweight / fractional Spanish silver was generally melted into ingots by East Asian merchants owing to transaction cost / different trade behaviours.
