Roman vs Holy Roman

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by JayAg47, May 29, 2021.

  1. JayAg47

    JayAg47 Well-Known Member

    m.png
    Here are my coins to keep it relevant,
    Optimus Princeps.
    trajan 5.png

    'Hand Heller', aka 'plague coin' from Germany's Schwäbisch Hall minted around 1350. It was one of the 'free imperial cities' of the Holy Roman Empire.
    hand.png

    Post your coins from Rome/HRE!
     
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  3. furryfrog02

    furryfrog02 Well-Known Member

    I love that hand coin! In fact, I just bid on one last night. I lost...but I did bid on one :p
     
  4. ancient coin hunter

    ancient coin hunter 3rd Century Usurper

    "The Holy Roman Empire was neither Holy nor Roman..."

    -Talk amongst yourselves (to quote an old SNL feature)
     
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  5. Bayern

    Bayern Active Member

    I have at least one 'hand heller', although not sure where it is at moment:(. But I do have others from Rome as well as many German and Austrian States coins that are relative, through the dissolution of the HRE in 1806. Have been working on cataloging many that I purchased some time ago. Will try to post some pictures, hopefully soon. :cat:
     
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  6. +VGO.DVCKS

    +VGO.DVCKS Well-Known Member

    That "neither" quote is from Voltaire. (I know that because it's my personal (mmmaybe a Little idiosyncratic) favorite line of his.) Here's a coissue of the emperor Konrad I and the future emperor Heinrich III as 'King of the Romans' (the German equivalent of the later Roman title, 'Caesar'). Triangulating from Konrad's death, that's 1028-1039.
    COINS, GERMANY, KONRAD AND HEINRICH III, YOURS, SPEYER, 1, OBV..jpg
    COINS, GERMANY, KONRAD AND HEINRICH III,YOURS, SPEYER, 1, REV..jpg
    The neo-Byzantine motif on the reverse predates the 'Great Schism' between Catholic and Eastern Orthodox communions (1055), while evoking the German "emperors'" readiness to appropriate Byzantine visual rhetoric.
    Konrad and Heinrich facing, both crowned. +CHONRADI P[atri]. HEINRICI
    St. Mary, haloed, face of the infant Christ in front of her. +SCA MARIA (Dannenberg 829)
     
  7. Hrefn

    Hrefn Well-Known Member

    Is this too early for the HRE?
    Carolingian: Silver denier of Louis the Child, gilded and probably ex jewelry, despite which it is in very nice shape. He died aged 17 or 18. Ultimately succeeded by Henry the Fowler. The Magyars ravaged his kingdom for much of his reign. The mint of Strasbourg was first Argentoratum, roughly the Silver or Treasure Fort, in Gaulish.
    upload_2021-5-29_16-33-21.png upload_2021-5-29_16-33-59.png
     
  8. dltsrq

    dltsrq Grumpy Old Man

    Though the empire may appear outwardly flawed, surely you will agree that all is truly for the best in this best of all possible worlds... ;)
     
  9. Hrefn

    Hrefn Well-Known Member

    Speaking candidly?
     
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  10. Clavdivs

    Clavdivs Well-Known Member

    upload_2021-5-29_18-8-3.png
    GERMANY, Schwäbisch Hall: AR Handheller, issued 1300-1356. 0.49g, 17mm.Obv: "hand of God"Rev: A cross with a pellet at each end.Cracked, with slivers of flan loss.

    The "hand heller" was in common use within southwest Germany in the 12th century, and soon became a de facto imperial coin. Many cities in the area coined their own Handhellar, but with no identifying mark (until an imperial edict of 1356 required a mintmark), there is no way to know for certain where these coins were minted.

    The disastrous mortal disease known as the Black Death spread across Europe in the years 1346-53. Approximately 50 million died in Europe

    upload_2021-5-29_18-10-13.png
    Trajan, AD 98-117
    Roman AR denarius; 2.92 gm, 20.1 mm, 7 h
    Rome, AD 114-117
    Obv: IMP CAES NER TRAIANO OPTIMO AVG GER DAC, laureate and draped bust, right
    Rev: P M TR P COS VI P P S P Q R, Mars walking right with spear and trophy
     
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  11. +VGO.DVCKS

    +VGO.DVCKS Well-Known Member

    LOL
     
  12. +VGO.DVCKS

    +VGO.DVCKS Well-Known Member

    Thanks, @Hrefn, for a Terrific coin, from one of the many earlier Carolingians who are as crazily scarce as most of the later ones. ...And, Yeah, starting from Charlemagne /Karl der Grosse's coronation as 'Roman Emperor in 800, and the rhetorical capital the German emperors drew from that, you get my vote for being in the right place with this one!
    ...I have one Salian (/11th c.) denar, recently posted somewhere here, where Strasbourg was still rendered with the Latin /Gaulish name. ...Ironically, my example has peck marks!
     
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  13. talerman

    talerman Well-Known Member

    Some coins struck in the name of CHARLES V, Holy Roman Emperor (1519-56)

    Charles was the most powerful political leader in Europe in the first half of the 16th century. In addition to being Holy Roman Emperor, with considerable authority over the rulers of lands from central Europe to northern Italy, he was also in his own right direct ruler of the Habsburg Austrian lands (which he delegated to his brother Ferdinand) and the Burgundian Netherlands, as well as a unified Spain and its possessions in southern Italy and the Americas. Despite this, there are not as many coins with his portrait as one might expect.

    Here are a selection of coins struck in his name, both with and without his portrait.

    SPANISH NETHERLANDS - BRABANT Karolus Gulden (or Florin) nd (1542-8)

    Brabant Chas V Karolus Gulden Florin 1st type nd LD obv 885.jpg Brabant Chas V Karolus Gulden Florin 1st type nd LD rev 894.jpg


    GERMANY HALL am KOCHER (SCHWÄBISCHE HALL) 1/2 Taler 1545 (with a later version of the hand arms which appeared on the 14th century Handheller posted by Claudius)

    Hall am Kocher Karl V Half Taler 1545 LD obv 248.jpg Hall am Kocher Karl V Half Taler 1545 LD rev 254.jpg



    GERMANY City of ULM Taler 1547

    Ulm Karl V Taler 1547 LD obv 236.jpg Ulm Karl V Taler 1547 LD rev 244.jpg



    NETHERLANDS (but part of the Empire) DEVENTER, CAMPEN & ZWOLLE - Joint Issue Daalder n.d. (1554)

    Deventer Kampen Zwolle Chas V Daalder nd 1554 LD obv 277.jpg Deventer Kampen Zwolle Chas V Daalder nd 1554 LD rev 282.jpg
     
  14. talerman

    talerman Well-Known Member

    Coins struck in the name of CHARLES V - continued

    ITALY NAPLES Carlino with young bust n.d.(1516-27)

    Naples Charles V Carlino Young head nd obv 503.jpg Naples Charles V Carlino Young head nd rev 510.jpg


    ITALY NAPLES Carlino with bearded bust n.d.(1528-46)

    Naples Chas V Carlino with R mm nd 1528-46 obv 373.jpg Naples Chas V Carlino with R mm nd 1528-46 rev 381.jpg


    ITALY NAPLES Tari (2 carlini) n.d.(1528-46)

    Naples Charles V Tari nd obv 335.jpg Naples Charles V Tari nd rev 339.jpg



    ITALY SICILY 2 Tari 1540

    Sicily Charles V 2 Tari 1540 obv 108.jpg Sicily Charles V 2 Tari 1540 rev 110.jpg



    SPAIN 3 Reales n.d. (1535)

    Ottoman admiral Hayreddin Barbarossa captured Tunis on 16 August 1534, ousting the ruler, Muley Hassan, subservient to the Spanish. In 1535 Charles V launched an expedition which destroyed Barbarossa's fleet and captured Tunis, restoring Muley Hassan. This was one of the many coins struck to pay the troops and military expenses. The expedition cost 1 million ducats. However, Spain was unable to maintain its control of Tunis for very long.
    The multi-field arms on the obverse reflect the extent of Charles V's dominions:1st qtr. Castile (3 tower gate) & Leon(lion) qtrd.; 2nd qtr. Aragon(vertical bars) & Sicily(vertical bars with 2 eagles); 3rd qtr. Austria (horizontal.bar), modern Burgundy (5 lis), ancient Burgundy (diagonal bars) &;Brabant (lion) with centre escutcheon of Flanders (lion) and Tyrol (eagle); 4th qtr. Jerusalem (cross) & Hungary (horizontal bars), with at bottom ente en point Granada (pomegranate).

    Spain Carlos I (Emp Ch V) 3 Reales nd 1535 LD obv 267.jpg Spain Carlos I (Emp Ch V) 3 Reales nd 1535 LD rev 273.jpg
     
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