Crossing NGC to PCGS just get same grade?

At the expense of CAC really, the price gap is just to large with those vs PCGS and NGC. CAC was supposed to be for high end coins only anyways which almost all go to PCGS/CAC, they never really wanted to be doing 100 dollar coins like they are now from collector demand.

 

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Spending money to cross over from NGC to PCGS is a waste of money from my perspective since I buy coins, not which of the two major services has graded the coin.

Still there are many collectors who view PCGS as the superior service which often results in high selling prices. Some collectors also view the PCGS registry as the more prestigious. Since PCGS will only accept their coins in their registry, crossing the NGC coins is required.

 

I once witnessed someone at a coin show purchase a $30,000 1797 draped bust half from the Heritage table, (graded by NGC), then immediately take it over to PCGS for express crossover so he could add it to his registry set. The next day, he found out it failed to cross, so he took it back to Heritage and demanded a refund. Since this person was a Heritage premier member, or whatever... he got his refund.

 

I might be wrong, but my perception is that when you try to cross from NGC to PCGS, you have two strikes against you if you are looking to get the same or (WOW!) a better grade. PCGS really does not like the competition. If you want to cross, I think that you need to bite the bullet and crack it out.

As for the $30,000, 1797 Bust Half Dollar, sadly $30 grand does not buy much for that coin. The Grey Sheet price for a Good is $27,500, and that is supposed to be wholesale. I have also heard from experienced dealers that the 1797 half is lot harder to find with good eye appeal than the 1796 varieties.

Years ago when I was a dealer, another dealer paid me $100 to take an NGC graded coin to see if it would cross to PCGS. I told him it probably wouldn't because it was an MS-64 Seated Half Dollar, and it had been dipped. He tried and failed, wasting another $100 + dollars. It was a nice coin, but PCGS has a certain "look" that they want, and that one did not have it.

 

Yeah I think it was a VG08 grade but had been cleaned. This was 7 or 8 years ago. NGC had given it a pass. PCGS wouldn’t.

 

When did NGC open their registry to PCGS ?

What is PCGS's response to why they won't reciprocate ?

 

They started out doing allowing PCGS coins and then stopped doing it about five years ago. About a year and half ago, they went back to accepting them.

PCGS is #1 in American coins and has no need to bow any pressure.

 

I wonder what the ratio of NGC coins crossing over to PCGS vs PCGS coins crossing over to NGC is?

 

It helps the hobby which directly/indirectly helps PCGS.

It's a narrow, self-interested POV, IMO.....I hope they reconsider. As I said, I have no skin in the game as I don't register....but anything that makes collecting easier helps grow the hobby.

 

No it doesn’t, it would help NGC and no one else. People win NGC awards with almost exclusively PCGS sets. NGC only allows PCGS coins because they have too. So many sets got deleted and so many people stopped using their registry when they banned PCGS that they really had no choice to accept them again.

 

I think that the NGC registry offers the opportunity to display a broader variety of coins with its PCGS acceptance policy. I also prefer the format of their registry.

 

I guess that's because so many key/top dates are only in PCGS slabs.

If the PCGS Premium fades, and more top-coins are in NGC holders, maybe PCGS will reconsider. But for today, I guess you're right -- no pressure to reciprocate.

 

Even then there's no reason for them to ever reconsider, all it does is elevate a competitor one which has written direct hit pieces on them as well. They have absolutely nothing to gain by doing so. The people doing them already have an option if they want a mixed set and the majority of PCGS participants would be furious. It would be like Boeing telling an airline to give part of their contract to Airbus

There's really little to no chance of that happening anyways when top coins are consistently crossed immediately to PCGS. There's been multiple times where a press release from NGC about a 6 or 7 figure coin that sold was in their holder and the coin was already crossed over to PCGS

 

Their arrogance will never let it happen.

 

Last night I was looking at a mint state dime on Heritages site. It was in a PCGS slab MS 63. When I looked at a similar coins sold in the past I noticed the same coin in a NGC slab with the same grade. In fact this was the third time this coin was in an auction. All the same grade. It didn't sell for a higher price either.

 

There are some high end coin buyers who won’t even look at any coin that is in a holder other than PCGS. How do I know this? I am aware of this from experience. A few of my high roller collector friends have gone to coin shows with me. I’ve met a number of them in Las Vegas at Legends auctions. I have even sold a few high end coins to them. There are individuals who won’t even consider even a nice NGC coin, as they are investing a lot of money, and want it backed up by market valuation, in their eyes. The PCGS/ CAC combination is the only combination that they will bid on or make offers, inasmuch as they want to make sure their large bankrolls are safeguarded.

 

They can do what they want. To bad for them because there are a large number of slabbed coins that haven't been sent to CAC. And many really nice coins in NGC slabs. I do understand their concern about maintaining their investment. However, this idea can backfire. For the super high end or super rare coins they still need a buyer when they want to sell their coins. Coins like the 1794 and 1804 dollars they tend to increase in value when sold in the future but, most of the lesser none coins there is no guarantee they will sell for more than what they paid for it. I've seen many cases where when a coin is sold in the future at an auction the selling price is lower. Price can be driven up by a bidding war and then when sold later there isn't a strong interest in the coin. This happens often, especially if there are a lot of high end auctions taking place.

 

For the really high-end coins....either the buyer himself is an excellent grader (i.e., Duckor) or he has hired advisors and experts as consultants.

So.....I would think (and it might be wrong, I admit) that an NGC coin that is solid for the grade (with or without CAC) can always be crossed to PCGS if the person really wants it.

I also wonder if super-high end collectors who are worth 9 figures or even billionaires really care if their coin has moved up or down by $100,000 by being in the right holder.

JMHO.

 

Oh yes they do. I can tell you that my friend from Naples is a fanatic about his coins. Some of them hire experts, but others are control freaks. I just told you how they acted at the Legends auctions in 2016.

 

Understood....

BTW, I don't know why the "This is not an opinion—this is what I have witnessed" is showing up in your post of my quote. But I didn't type that.

Must be a glitch.