Appreciate your opinions on PCGS grading of this coin

Just purchased this 1834 Large Cent, Large "8", Large stars, medium letters, on Great Collections. PCGS certified it as a details coin (excessive corrosion) with Fine details. i don't question that it has corrosion and warrants a details certification. I do question whether it is just Fine details -- appreciate your opinions on whether you think PCGS erred (or was excessively tight) on stating that it was just Fine details. Looks to me that it should have been at least a VF details certification.

Regardless, I'm very pleased to land this one -- these are hard to come across.
Thanks in advance for your comments and opinions.

 

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I would agree with PCGS on this coin.

 

Details are definitely VF

 

Indeed. Yes, there is some corrosion, but to call it “excessive” is, well, excessive. No? In terms of wear, I would grade it as some flavor of XF, maybe 45. I think what they did was to engage in unacknowledged net grading, but down to F20 is, well, excessive!
Dave S.

 

Definitely feel like its undergraded, yeah, theres a lot of corrosion but I would go at least mid-VF for sure

 

Way undergraded its VF details at least.

 

I agree that the coin has the sharpness of high VF, low EF. But it would really be a case of "double-dipping" to say the coin is details and then to also net grade it by virtue of the reason for the details grade. That's a double-penalty for the same reason. I can't see them doing that and I can't recall a case of ever seeing it before.

There is also something odd about their use of the word "excessive". Normally, if they give a reason on the slab for the details grade, it's just a generic reason, i.e. "Scratch"; "Graffiti"; or "Tooled". They never employ adjectives to describe the degree of the problem, except perhaps when they say "Improper Cleaning".

When I look this coin up on PCGS Certs, it is there and listed as code 97 - "Environmental Damage". The code 97 matches the slab. So, why would they slab it with "Excessive Corrosion"?

 

I agree with PCGS as well

 

It's fairly common for detaiils coins to get knocked down a level.

 

I think that 40 is a stretch but 30 to 35 details is deserved. The fact that is a N-6, with a R.3 rarity makes it a great find.

 

They do something similar with cleaned as some coins are called "harshly cleaned" while others are simply "cleaned".

I think it makes sense to add these adjectives on some coins to show the difference (as there are different levels of cleaned and corroded). However, I can see this causing issues as there might be too much subjectivity involved in certain cases.

 

I have always read that the TPGs give the full sharpness grade of a details coin but I'll take your word for it that they add insult to injury by net-grading them also. I may not have ever noticed it because I just have never paid any real attention to the grades given details coins versus their actual sharpness. Still, it seems like overkill to net grade a coin that's been given a details grade.

 

Yea it's kinda a kick to the groin and doesn't always happen, its just not uncommon with the most egregious reasons to see a vf in an f type thing.

 

Based on what I'm seeing of the ANA Grading Standards for this coin...in the series it's in and notwithstanding the corrosion issue...they were justified with either a F detail notation or a VF detail notation...too close to call definitively IMO. They chose F details based on their interpretations/opinions of the standards and where/how this fit...but indeed the corrosion may have played a part on that, one way or another.

 

I'll agree with PCGS. Much of the detail is missing and whats still there is just ugly.

 

vf details but details no doubt but undergraded on the letter grade without a doubt but in the end "details" large cents all have the same list value..... $0.00.... Don't think so? PCGS lists my 1857 large letters as genuine- details-surface damage Value-0.... so the "grade" doesn't really matter...
The real value is whatever you can get someone to pay for it.

 

It's an N-5, which is rarer than an N-6. I agree with you that it probably deserves a 30 details grade. As to value, it is a matter of what someone would pay for a details coin with that level of details, but I don't plan on selling it. This was the last one I needed for the Coronet Head type coins in my collection, so I'm very happy with it. Just need some 1793's (Chain, Wreath, Liberty Cap), 1796's, 1799, and 1804 to complete my Large Cent collection.

 

very nice!
and while a 93 and a 96 are obtainable I wish you the best of luck on the 99 and 04 Large cents are probably my Favorite US coin series

 

@Revello, off topic but re your avatar: Bernard Cornwell is one of my favorite authors.

 

Fantastic author. His Last Kingdom ("Uhtred") series and Richard Sharpe series brought me months and months of most enjoyable reading. I read his other works, but those two series are the best, by far, in my opinion.