What to look for in Trade Dollar fakes

Discussion in 'US Coins Forum' started by spartanic, Sep 6, 2005.

  1. spartanic

    spartanic New Member

    How can you tell if a Trade Dollar is fake? What are the signs to look for?
     
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  3. huntsman53

    huntsman53 Supporter**

    The ability to spot a fake takes experience and knowledge! However, there are a few things you can learn by hands on and also things to look for. Also, always keep a good Gem Loupe on hand for checking out any and all coins.

    By a hands on comparison of a fake to a real Trade Dollar, you can usually tell by the feel of the coin (i.e. weight and how it feels compared to a genuine Trade Dollar) and also by the ring (sound) it makes. A fake is produced from a mold and there is usually easily identifiable evidence of this. Portions of the fields (the flat surface of the coin) mainly near and around details, the rim and lettering as well as most of the details and the rim will usually have a bubbly porous look because of air bubbles getting trapped in the composition when it is poured into the mold. The details (images) and lettering will be indistinct and will not have sharp edges as would be found with a coin produced from Dies. Next, look for irregularities on the rim and reeded edge for repairs of a hole as this is evidence of where the pour hole was in respect to the mold. The reeded edge may also be rough and irregular with uneven spacing between the reeding. Also, you may often find a dark gray and sometimes almost blackening color on the rim, scattered through some or all of the lettering and sometimes extending several milimeters inwards from the rim. This is evidence of scorching which occurs when the composition is too hot when it is poured into the mold.

    You should weigh the coin which will usually tell you right away that it is a fake. Most Counterfeiters either never get the composition (.900 Silver and .100 Copper weighing at or very close to 27.22 grams) correct or use a composition of cheaper materials that are either heavier or lighter than the normal weight of a Trade Dollar.

    Oher than that, experience and knowledge is your best defense!


    Frank
     
  4. kaparthy

    kaparthy Well-Known Member

    In Numismatics, Knowledge is King

    I agree with many of Huntsman's suggestions. However, many are no longer mainly relevant. I have seen machine struck fake Seated Dollars and Trade Dollars coming from China. Machine tool technology is old-fashioned 20th century production. If labor were not so cheap in China, they could robotize the manufacture of fake coins. So, the bubbly fields and other cast coin telltales do work for older fakes -- and many of those still kick around. However, these are eclipsed by machine struck fakes that look remarkably good.

    I agree that handling the coin is important. You have to get a feel for them.

    Start with a book about them. Read Taxay and Breen. Then shop at reputable places like ANA and regional conventions. Once you see enough of them, the fakes jump out.

    If you just want to buy one for your collection, buy one that is slabbed by a reputable grading service.

    If you want to actually touch the coin, then buy it from a dealer at an ANA convention or regional show where a code of ethics and a board of governors is in place.

    Obviously, coin stores are a good opportunity. Check the ANA website (www.money.org) for coin stores near you who are ANA members.

    My recommendation, if you want to own just one, is to buy it slabbed.
     
  5. huntsman53

    huntsman53 Supporter**

    I have been lucky so far and have only encountered the old Counterfeited Trade Dollars, Seated Liberty Dollars, Bust Dollars and several Gold Pieces so far! I have seen some really good ones done in molds and many bad ones as well.

    I really need to get one of the newer machine struck fakes so that I can get to know what to look for. I purchased a 1921 Peace Dollar on eBay last year that I am still sure was a fake. I sent it in to ANACS and they sent it back graded AU-50 with Enviromental Damage. There was something real fishy going on about the coin and some of the parties are still being investigated concerning it and some others as well.


    Frank
     
  6. bulldawg

    bulldawg Senior Member

    Here is a pic of a good counterfit trade dollar. The coin looks real till you feel the weight and look at it under magnification, it looks grainy. The coin looks better in hand than in the pic.
     

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  7. huntsman53

    huntsman53 Supporter**

    bulldawg,

    Nice looking coin for a Counterfeit! How much did you pay for it and I hope that you weren't taken??!!


    Frank
     
  8. bulldawg

    bulldawg Senior Member

    Bought it knowing it was a counterfiet. I have quite a few and thought about putting a set together if I could find all of them. I have some others that are terrible looking counterfiets, they are mushy looking and bubbly.
     
  9. lawdogct

    lawdogct Coin Collector

    I'd also suggest you use the same method of spotting counterfeiting that US Govt agents use. Know the real thing. In and out. Up and Down. Side to side. Front to back. Study it until its all you see in your dreams. Once you know the original, fakes and errors will stand out from a mile away.
     
  10. bulldawg

    bulldawg Senior Member

    Here is a pic of a 1876 counterfit trade dollar that is mushy looking. :D
     

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  11. bzcollektor

    bzcollektor SSDC Life Member

    "The ability to spot a fake takes experience and knowledge! However, there are a few things you can learn by hands on and also things to look for. Also, always keep a good Gem Loupe on hand for checking out any and all coins."

    Experience, Experience. Trade Dollars are a land mine. Quite frankly, I can`t understand why anyone would even ask about buying Trade Dollars, unless they already knew the series well.
     
  12. satootoko

    satootoko Retired

    Well isn't that a chicken/egg situation? To really know the series well, you have to see many of them up close. For those forumites who don't live near a friendly, knowledgeable dealer, doing that is problematic.

    I've been forced to learn a little about US and British Trade Dollars in conjunction with studying the Japanese TDs, and after some years of reading about them, looking at coin forum posts about them, and talking with other collectors about them, I still feel woefully inadequate when faced with a buy/don't buy decision, especially when they're not in those infernal slabs. :eek:

    What I have learned is that there are far more fakes out there than genuine pieces, and that a large portion of those fakes can be instantly detected by the simple technique of checking weight and diameter! :p

    Many more can be detected by careful examination of the surfaces and the "third side", where evidence of casting shows up.

    That leaves a large number that siimply can't be authenticated without direct examination of the coin by an expert. :(
     
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