1909 S VDB High $ fake?

Check this one out. Were it is in question why 16 bids and high $'s?

http://cgi.ebay.com/1909-S-VDB-PCGS...dual?hash=item2555b2934b&_trksid=p3911.c0.m14

 

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If anybody buys this, they have more money than brains.

 

yeah! that VDB looks just wrong!

 

For the record (when this thread is old and the link to the auction is dead) the coin is a 1909-S VDB that has been returned from PCGS as a "No Decision". That means they cannot say for certain that the coin is counterfeit or altered nor can they say for certain that it is genuine. If it is a fake it is a VERY good one. The seller is selling this coin in its bodybag and the current bid is over $300.

How long do you think this coin will stay in the bodybag after the buyer receives it? You know he will remove it from the bodybag and sell it as genuine to an unsuspecting buyer for much, much more than he bought it for.

 

forget the VDB, look at that 'S'!

the seller says: "It is not a cheap Chinese knock-off but, worse case is a contemporary counterfeit, best case, is genuine but PCGS could not confirm as such. Either way it is an excellent album place filler for your DANSCO Lincoln set of cents."

so, $305, so far, for a fake?

Also, more interesting, I didn't know that PCGS gave refunds!

 

I think this was a 1909 VDB with a added S, though it is hard to say as poor as the pictures are of the VDB.

I dont see any signs of glue, but, that S does not look right for the S VDB IMO.

 

I don't read it that way. I read it as No decision, no refund.

 

I read it the opposite!

 

It always matters regardless of value or grade.I think there is a criminal element (even when unintended) involved with cleaning or "doctoring" coins.Eventually, most coins get traded or sold.Who knows how many newbe's to our hobby have been discouraged this way.If your honest,great! The folks that buy it after its resold may not be and the problem goes on, Rarities should not be an exception. NCS and ANACS will grade and holder a problem coin. I never knowingly buy or sell a cleaned or problem coin regardless of rarity.Ebay is a good example. Enlarge what looks like a cleaned or problem coin,read the sellers item description. 90% of these guys with long winded descriptions, not a word about an obvious cleaning.etc. etc. Yes, cleaning ALWAYS devalues a coin even if it was covered with crap. Please dont contribute to the coin doctoring trade by cleaning or altering any coin period.

 

I read it opposite too. I don't know what their actual policies are...but I would imagine if they can't make a decision on the coin they would refund the submission fee. You are paying for their expert opinion and if they have none you haven't gotten what you paid for. I could be wrong though.

 

Short and sweet HOBO !! Well said. Ive tried to buy and sell US coins and the economy... ... Ive heard it said " coin dealers are one step up from grave robbers!" Im amazed how many folks buy problem holdered coins? Are they stupid? Not likely. They will crack them out and resell as problem free!! Discourages me, im a 30 yr man in this hobby among others.

 

Well, you must commend the seller for posting the facts.

 

You gotta me kidding me PCGS!!! That is an OBVIOUS fake, any experienced Lincoln collector would laugh at that coin within the first 5 seconds of looking at it.

I have to admit, I would probably have paid up to $20-30 for it as a novelty piece. I do have a pretty nice "added S" one that I like.

 

You almost wonder if the seller put that coin in the BB to make it look more legit.

 

The S is completely wrong "font" and size.

 

Many seem to think the vast majority of coin doctoring is done by amatuers. Dipping,wire brushing by hand or Dremel etc. These guys are not trying to fool the experienced collector.The newbe's get hurt and we need newbe's to be happy so interest increases. increased interest,increased sales,increases in our coin values.Unfortunately, this process also works in reverse. I knew counterfeit PCGS,NGC holders were coming. Damned Chinese!! Not illegal to counterfeit American coin over there. Ebay is loaded with these guys! Buyer beware beacase eBay dont care!

 

I agree that is a no brainier... that "S" is all wrong

 

Exactly what I was thinking. There is ZERO chance PCGS wouldn't BB that coin as counterfeit. He may have bought that tag from someone too....who knows. There's cheats buying empty silver proof set holders and reloading them with clads, the switcheroo wouldn't surprize me in the least.

The bottomline, that coin is one of the most obvious fakes I've ever seen in an S-VDB. In fact, I think I've seen that exact same coin listed on ebay before.....that surface finish and the S look familiar to me.

 

that's what I thought. The font looks funny to me, almost like times new roman.

 

I agree. That coin is sooooooo fake PCGS would never send back as no decision. The seller is obviously trying to trick the buyers......a very bad move for a normally good person ( a PCGS forum member !! ) to try and pull off. What an instant reputation wrecker.

I have sent an email letting the seller know how astonished I am at his stooping to this level of deceit.

EDIT
Auction pulled by seller