New member interested in collecting Peace and Morgan Dollars

I just bought a few hundred dollars in Morgan and Peace dollars off of ebay. This is my first purchase of coins since I was a kid. I'm just looking to collect basic dates in AU except I don't want rediculously overstruck years like the 1921 Morgan.

As I've been out of the hobby for years, I didn't realize China was making fakes of Morgans and Peace dollars now. Can anyone help me out with this? Are many of the fakes done in silver and for common years? Are the fakes in the millions yet or still a small but growing problem?

I've been studying up on how to visually identify counterfeit coins but would like some easy guidelines such as does the weight tend to be correct, does the alloy tend to be correct etc.

Lastly, if anyone here is a seller on ebay and ships worldwide feel free to post or pm me because I'm an American in South Korea and having some difficulty finding sellers. Two sellers have even claimed it's illegal to send coins from the US to South Korea which is not true!

 

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Welcome to CoinTalk, KP.

Good luck with your purchase. You never know what you're getting from eBay. I hope your coins are not overgraded, overdipped, cleaned, polished, etc.

A saying you will see a lot around here is "Buy the book before the coin." Many (maybe most) collectors make the mistake of rushing out and buying coins before they know what they are doing and only realize later that they made a mistake, overpaid, bought problem coins, etc.

Do a search of CoinTalk for the "Chinese counterfeit" and you will find lots of good info to help you get started identifying Chinese counterfeits.

Most of them are made from base metals and will weigh less than genuine examples. Most of the Chinese counterfeits have diagnostics that show them to be counterfeit, e.g., tool marks, porous surfaces, raised lumps, lack of detail, etc. BUT more recent counterfeits coming out of China are MUCH better and are within US Mint specs for weight and diameter because they are using planchets of the correct alloy. They are using lasers and computers to create their dies. Still, most of these counterfeits can be detected (if you know what to look for) but they are getting better every month.

 

Thank you for your detailed answer.

I realize now I should have done my research first, things seems to have changed quite a bit since I was a kid collecting. I've done the forum search on here and seen some good information about looking a the date for tool marks, indentations etc.

What I want to know is if I get a 90% silver coin of correct weight (something I can check) how likely would a common date of a Morgan or Peace be counterfeit, especially a good one?

 

There are several levels of fakes. The lowest are those made for the souvenir shops, pot metal, often cast with a seam, even most novices can spot these. Next level up is die struck, sometimes real silver, sometimes not. Sometimes these have incorrect die pairings such as using the 1921 reverse on the pre-1905 coins.

For the key dates, the better dates, the fakes can be very deceptive, as the intent is to fool, and the audience is tougher to fool. These will be die struck, 90% silver, correct weight. Sometimes the minor details such as the denticles or other small details are off. These will vary in quality, and the very best will fool many.

It is worth noting that they are also making fake slabs as well. Fake coins in fake slabs, real coins in fake slabs at a higher grade are gold mines for counterfeiters. The profit per piece can be huge. Some of the early fake slabs had minor flaws in font or bar code, or spacing. It is likely that these obvious visual flaws have now been fixed and the fake slabs are now 99.9% visually the same as the real ones.

For someone in South Korea, collecting Morgans it is an uphill battle. Many reputable U. S. dealers will not want to ship there. If they do, it will cost. A decent scale and some books will help against the lower tiers of fakes, but it literally takes years of education to filter out the better fakes. For the average collector it is not a realistic option. Perhaps 5% of collectors can authenticate and most of them have a decade or more of experience. It is more like 0.001% that can do so with absolute confidence.

 

For basic silver dollars, check out alaskacoinexchange.com. I've had good experiences with them [I have no personal or business interest in them]. It's much safer than Ebay and you can usually find things you are looking for without waiting for someone to put the coin up for auction.

 

Here a good place to look

 

Here's a good article to read:

http://coins.about.com/od/caringforcoins/tp/counterfeit_coin_detection.htm?nl=1

And the other members have made good points also! :thumb:

Ribbit

 

......here's one on silver eagles.

http://coins.about.com/od/goldrarecoininvesting/f/fake_coin_fraud.htm?nl=1

 

Thanks everyone, I'll take a look at the articles. Do you guys like powersellers over people who've had a few hundred sales but seem like they are the on up and up?

 

.......you're probably talking e-bay. i stay away from the bay.

 

You'll probably want the two relevant Whitman Guide Books: "A Guide Book to Morgan Dollars" and "A Guide Book to Peace Dollars." Retail is $19.95 for each.

 

The guide books are good, and as far as the powerseller/non-powereseller, I believe their are good and bad in both catagories. Good luck and have fun.

 

I've seen a few morgans that look sort of..dull is this something suspicious? There seem to be a number of examples from 1900? Here's an auction right now http://cgi.ebay.com/1900-O-Morgan-S...CI%2BIA%2BUA%2BFICS%2BUFI&otn=15&po=LBI&ps=54

What do you guys think?

Anyone else have opinions on the powersellers vs found my Grandfather's old coins type?

 

Have you considered collecting Koreans coins. They do have some interesting coins, especially from the turn of the century. You're right there at the source for coins you may not be able to get in the USA, collect Morgans and Peace $ when you get back to the states.

http://worldcoingallery.com/countries/Skorea.php

 

BTW, maybe you can help this guy out.

http://www.cointalk.com/forum/t61863/

 

I would definetly stay away from this auction. First off it might not be the coin you get since it says 2 available. Secondly, it sure doesn't look BU from the lousy scan, picture.

 

Yeah that auction didn't look right at all, wasn't going to bid on it, thanks for checking it out though.

Nothing wrong with Korean coins, I have a few mint sets, but I particularly like coins with silver and gold content which were ony coined under the Japanese occupation and are terribly expensive now.

 

Morgans had all different levels of luster, but aslo tons of them have also been overdipped and dulled that way. I would say the one in this particular aucion is neither BU or un-dipped.