? Makes No sense to me

Why is the 1883 Cents V nickel worth more than the No Cents

• 1883 Without Cents 5,474,300 Mintage
• 1883 With Cents 16,026,200

 

Log in or Sign up to hide this ad.

I've wondered that same thing.

I don't get it.

 

Because of how many were saved vs spent. Find a good unc 1883 for a type set and guess which one it will be. While the mintages may be higher the surviving numbers, especially in higher grade are smaller.

 

Exactly! Mintage and surviving examples are two entirely different animals.

 

Well, I assume that the 1883 NO CENTS V nickel, were melted, due to many of them being plated in gold, trying to fool people into thinking that they were $5 gold pieces, rather than 5 cent, pieces
So survival rate of the coin, is a major factor
The 1933 Gaudens is rarer than the other gaudens minted, even though some have lower mintage numbers...
The reason why...THERE IS ONLY ONE KNOWN TO EXIST!
So, it all has to do with the survival of a certain coin... Or what everybody else said before me!

 

It has to do with hoarding. Everybody hoarded unc 1883 no cents nickels while the later minted version - with cents - was over looked. I have a 1883 no cents in EF/AU; however, an 1883 w/ cents EF/AU costs ~4 times as much.

 

Yep, once people heard the No cent nickels would be changed, they were hoarded, so much more survived in high grades, then the Cents ones.

 

Only V Nickel I care about is a 1913!
I will pay $50 for one... LOL!!!!!
Nah, I love the V Nickels, and some day I want a complete set, in proof

 

The introduced the new 'With Cents' variety later in the year but to my knowledge the Mint did not melt the 1883 No Cents Liberty Nickels.

There are at least 11 known examples of the '33 Double Eagle. 10 are tied up in litigation at the moment and one is legal to own. The reason the '33 Double Eagle has so few surviving examples is FDR took the US off the gold standard and discontinued the minting of gold coins and recalled all gold coins (with a few exceptions) in 1933. When FDR's order was made a good number of 1933 Double Eagles and Eagles had already been minted. A few Eagles had been released but no '33 Double Eagles had been legally released. All remaining 1933 gold coins were melted. But obviously a few '33 Double Eagles found their way out of the Mint - illicitly. That is where the 11 known examples came from. I would be willing to bet there are more out there. The owners do not want their '33 Double Eagles to be known for fear of confiscation (as happened to the 10 examples in litigation now).

 

Travis,

The NO CENTS nickel is the one that has a lower mintage and lower price. The racketeer nickels really have no bearing on the OP's question. Melting of the NO CENTS nickels would only exacerbate the problem.

You and everyone else is right that the survival rate is the determining factor. When the Liberty Nickel was first introduced, many Americans saved an uncirculated example. Of course these are of the NO CENTS variety which was minted and distributed into circulation first. By the time the CENTS variety hit circulation, everyone who had saved an 1883 Liberty nickel already had one and not much attention was paid to the CENTS vs NO CENTS which explains why such a higher mintage ended up with a much lower survival rate.

BTW, there is more than one 1933 St Gaudens $20 in existence. The one you are thinking of is the only one legal to own. To my recollection, there are between 20-30 known 1933 St Gaudens Double Eagles in existence. I am sure someone will come along with the exact number.

 

Well Gaudens aren't my thing, so anybody who can clarify is a life saver
The thing is with the gaudens, or at least what I don't understand is why there are illegal to own. I mean, a law that was made more than 70 years ago, which I'm guessing would have little affect now, still comes into play? So if I found a 33' Gaudens, what could I do, can't sell it, and can't let others know about it, so I just keep quiet about it? All very confusing.

 

I Never said the mint melted them...
People could have melted these coins...
Seeing the gold plating, could have fooled them...
Once they were gold plated, they could be passed as $5 Gold Pieces, wasn't this the whole reason that they added CENTS in the first place???
So people, who were not as bright, could have melted, hoping for gold, only to be fooled...
This is just one theory, although not a whole lot to prove it, other than a low survival rate.

 

T$,

We have many laws older than 70 years that are still in effect. Laws against murder come to mind.

The reason that the 1933 Double Eagle is illegal to own is it was never released. So if you have one it was originally obtained illegally, no matter how you obtained it. It is similar to owning stolen property; you may have done everything right when you bought an Old Masters painting but if it was stolen by the Germans during WWII (and can be documented to have been stolen) it is still stolen property and must be returned to its rightful owner.

So why is ONE '33 DE legal to own? Because there was a huge court case and the government agreed to allow that ONE coin to be sold (with the US gov't getting half the proceeds).

 

Yes but that would make a stronger argument why they should be more expensive, when they actually aren't.

I thought I remember reading somewhere there was thought to be around 30 33' Gaudens. I know right now 10 are in litigation, it was just in the last edition of NN.

 

I have never heard that one before. But I guess anything is possible. Good luck on proving that theory.

 

Tmoney

The illegality of the '33 has nothing to do with the 70 year old law. The reason they are illegal to own is that the government never officially released the coin and therfor consider any out there to be property stolen from the US government.

Richard

 

I type WAY too slow!

 

There is a book written on the subject called ILLEGAL TENDER by David Tripp. A must read for any Numismatist IMO. Anyway, here is a passage from the Author's Note at the end of the book that should settle this debate.

Within the coin collecting circles it was generally assumed that a few of the coins had legitmately slipped into circulation despite the government's arguments to the contrary. It was also assumed that the government's sole cause for rounding them up and tarring them illegal was as part of FDR's general recall of all gold coins and abandonment of the gold standard. As his laws were rewritten and over the next half century and private ownership of gold once again legalized, it was theorized, in numismatic circles, that this would similarly legitimize ownership of any 1933 double eagles that might, somehow, have eluded the keen eyes of the Secret Service.

I, too, accepted this interpretation of history until the United States Government signed a contract with Sotheby's to sell the coin at auction and enormous piles of legal documents, depositions, and archival Secret Service reports were made available to Sotheby's and Stack's for research.

What a shock it was. I was Sotheby's Special Consultant on the auction, and when those of us charged with researching the story for the auction catalogue read those documents, we were in unanimous and virtually instantaneous agreement that the long-accepted assumptions bore little relationship to what had actually happened seventy years previously. The legality of the 1933 double eagle no longer hinged on legal subtleties and oral tradition. It had been the target of a serious Secret Service investigation that concluded that all of the 1933 double eagles had been stolen from the United States Mint. That was the reason for the sixty years of unrelenting attention.

But the reason for the half-century of numismatic misunderstanding was quite simply the government's fault: it never explained to the coin collecting fraternity that the 1933 double eagle was deemed illegal because it was stolen property. Had it done so, Steve Fenton would undoubtedly have avoided the coin like the plague--and I would have no book.


So the real reason and the generally accepted reasons are different. I urge everyone to read that book, you won't be disappointed.

 

Than whats the point?? Why not release them all???
Why difference does it make if they release them all?
The ones that they have, that nobody can own, do they intend to melt them? What are their plans for those badboys

 

Well, it is bound to have happened, maybe it could have been just one coin, but you never know what happened, if you were not there yourself